Since the car tomm is going to be 3 months old and I have 3894 miles on it i'm taking it to the dealer for my first oil change. Is it better to take the car normally to the dealer for oil changes or the local shops? While my 2000 Ford Focus was under warranty i always brought it into the dealer for service and had no problems major that is. Just the usualy ware n tear.

I got a loyalty coupon for free oil change from the dealer and a card for 15% off all future service... guess where I'm taking mine? ;)

The dealership. They do a quick inspection along with the first oil change. I got $9.95 oil changes for the life of my HHR from the dealership I purchased it from.

Why cant I every get lucky. $21.95 for my oil change from the dealer.

Even at $21.95 the dealer oil change is a good idea the first year or so. Only the dealer will be aware of any TSB's (Technical Service Bulletins), pertaining the the HHR (this includes recalls, upgrades, failing parts, etc.), every time you take a new car in always ask the service writer to have them "check it out" just to make sure everything is safe. Sometimes they will replace a part GM recommends action on.

Hope it helps,

I would do it myself but for the price I pay the dealer its not worth it. I thought you were suposed to stay with conventional oil during the break in period and then switch to synthetic after the engine is all broken in? :confused:

I've never used synthetic. Is it worth it?

Yes, but you wont feel it in your car. I will switch to synthetic once I start moding my engine. You can expect a small horsepower and torque increase, increased gas milage, and lower exhaust emissions. Also there is less breakdown inside your engine. My favorite synthetic is good old Royal Purple.
See, I don't completely hate purple. :p:

I'll have to try it out. Will anything change if I go from synthetic back to normal?

No, but once you go synthetic you probably will not want to go back.

Is this a good Deal?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Royal-Purple-Synthetic-Oil-6-Quart-Case-Free-S-H-US48_W0QQitemZ8066902560QQcategoryZ46098QQrdZ1QQcm dZViewItem

Is this a good Deal?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Royal-Purple-Synthetic-Oil-6-Quart-Case-Free-S-H-US48_W0QQitemZ8066902560QQcategoryZ46098QQrdZ1QQcm dZViewItem

No, it breaks down to $7.49 per quart. You can find it for the same price or cheaper at your local auto parts store.

I agree with SoCal that you might want to use the dealer for your initial servicing especially if your not really into doing your own maintenance, this would be better just incase there are any TSB's etc. that need to be taken care of.

Me personally, I don't like anyone working on my car so I do all my own maintenance. I only take mine to the dealer if something major goes wrong or if there's some kind of TSB or reacll that needs to be addressed.

As far as oil goes I switch out to synthetics at 1k, I've done this with every new car I've bought over the past 40 years and have never had a problem. No matter which synthetic you choose, all are better than fossil oils.

I use M1 and alway's have. I've done a ton of research on the subject since I'm not one to beleive manufactures claims. I've checked on several independant organizations research data and M1 almost always comes out listed in the top 3 best choices and is always the best in cost. As the researchers say, you can pay more for oils like Red Line, Royal Purple, etc. The added cost will not provide you any benefit, but will always help line the pockets of the manufacture. The most important thing with any oil weather it's fossil or synthetic is to use a regualr routine schedule.

OK Thanks guys..
M1= Mobil 1?

Yes...M1= Mobil 1

Yes, but you wont feel it in your car. I will switch to synthetic once I start moding my engine. You can expect a small horsepower and torque increase, increased gas milage, and lower exhaust emissions. Also there is less breakdown inside your engine. My favorite synthetic is good old Royal Purple.
See, I don't completely hate purple. :p:

I use Amsoil full syn. Sure noticed a difference going from the dealer pump oil to that. Fuel milage is up, engine runs a little cooler and noticed a little peper car. Love this oil. I even get it cheap. My brother is a Amsoil dealer.:smile: :thumb:

I change the oil myself also, using mobil 1 synthetic. I have found the HHR to be the easiest car I have ever had to change the oil. The filter is easily accessible from the top and the drain plug is easy to get to without raising the car. I highly recomend doing it yourself, especially if you are using synthetic. Most places I have seen charge about $60 for a synthetic oil change, but you can buy 5 quarts of mobil 1 synthetic for about $20 at walmart. Just my two cents.

Do service stations generally provide synthetic oil if you ask for it? I've got a "quick lube" joint I usually take my cars to. They've always been really good with my vehicles and since I don't have the time or the inclination to do it myself, I take it to them. I've never asked them about synth oils. Is it true they only have to be changed every 10,000 miles or so?

What is the best oil filter for M1 synthetic?

What is the best oil filter for M1 synthetic?

In my research on oils and oil filters the Pure One oil filter by Purolator actually rated the best, with the super giant filter folks at K&N not even making it into the top 10. Amsoil and M1 were the top two oils with the M1 being the oil of choice only because they both ranked high but the M1 costs much less (unless you have a hookup). On air filters K&N didn't do well either and ranked in the top 5 but not in the top three. ITG air filters came in as #1 filter. I did this research about a year ago so I don't have all the details. Like most people, I remember the facts that are important to me.

I tried synthetic oil. I felt it in my engine, in my house, at work. It actually increased my emissions so my wife switched me back to olive oil. :rof:

Remember: If you can't laugh at yourself, who can you laugh at??

Remember: If you can't laugh at yourself, who can you laugh at??

Your in-laws? :D

I tried synthetic oil. I felt it in my engine, in my house, at work. It actually increased my emissions so my wife switched me back to olive oil. :rof:

Remember: If you can't laugh at yourself, who can you laugh at??

Hmmmmm, olive oil....I wonder if they make it in a synthetic...LOL

Yeah, it's called Canola ;)

my dealer told me that i should only change the oil when it gets down to 0% and i should change it within 600 miles...he said the average life is 6-7000 miles unlike older cars where they need oil change every 2-3000

I got unlimited 14.95 oil changes from my dealer to

my dealer told me that i should only change the oil when it gets down to 0% and i should change it within 600 miles...he said the average life is 6-7000 miles unlike older cars where they need oil change every 2-3000

I got unlimited 14.95 oil changes from my dealer to

Well I myself wouldn't do that...but it's your HHR. :confused: If you're going to do that, I'd be sure to get it in writing from them. My dealer told me to bring mine in again in another 3,000 miles and that's what I'll be doing. :thumb:

if you got a Wall Mart around you they have 5 qt containers of Mobil 1 for 21.95. that makes it about $4.39 per qt, saving you more than 5 bucks. Plus it makes it real easy for the guys at the dealership or wherever you decide to change your oil because all they have to do is open and pour one bottle.

my dealer told me that i should only change the oil when it gets down to 0% and i should change it within 600 miles...he said the average life is 6-7000 miles unlike older cars where they need oil change every 2-3000

I got unlimited 14.95 oil changes from my dealer to

Your dealer is pretty much on the money with this information. Vehicles can run a lot longer on an oil change today than years past. The reason for this is a multitude of things. For one, engines are built a lot better today than in years past. For another, oils today are much better than they were in the past and have much better additives so they don't break down as rapidly. Then you toss synthetics into the mix and they're way more superior than fossil oils, so this even allows for more miles between changes, (some even have a 25,000 mile change recommendation). And today's filters are much better also.

I managed a fleet of 7,000+ vehicles here in Florida until I retired. Many years ago we went to a 12 month 7,500 mile oil and filter interval on our entire world wide fleet of 175,000 vehicles (all american made). We have never lost an engine due to an oil failure related issue and although I'm retired now the fleet continues to use this schedule and is a growing fleet. Ant these vehicles ALL use fossil oil and where available they use re-refined oil.

Many people involved in the oil industry have recommended 3k and 5k oil change intervals, the only thing this interval serves is to put money into their pockets. These intervals are only needed for severe use vehicles like taxi's, Police, etc.

Take a hard look at what most manufactures are now recommending, many are now recommending oil and filter changes in the 7k area.

Another thing to consider. What's the hardest thing on an engine that causes most of the wear? It's called a dry start. Now think about this for a minute, the more often you drain your crankcase to change the oil, the better the opportunity your engine will have for a dry start condition.

I've been using the 7k interval on my cars for over 30 years and have never had an oil related issue with any of my cars. We put 250,000 miles on my wifes 91 Ford festiva and when we finally traded it in for something a bit larger the dealer about flipped when he read the speedometer, and the engine still purred like a kitten. One of the salesmen actually bought the car from the dealership for his daughter to drive to school.

Keep in mind that I only use M-1 Synthetic oil and have been now for about 30 years or so.

BTW: Just to let you know. I mentioned above that I retired as a fleet manager but I didn't alway's do that. I was at one point a wrench turner for a living and have been certified by GM (GM Training Center, New Oleans, LA) in Delco Air Conditioning, Brakes, Engine Repair / Overhaul and Servicing, and Automatic Transmissions Repair / Overhaul and Servicing. Although I gave up being a mechanic for management several years ago, I've continued this on my own as a hot rodder / engine builder. I've rebuilt many engines for people over the years for both street and race cars. For the street car owners I recommend using the 7k interval as well, and so far I've never had an engine come back for failure.

Keep in mind that I only use M-1 Synthetic oil and have been now for about 30 years or so.

Wow that's cool. :cool: I didn't even know they made synthetic oil thirty years ago. :red:

What is the milage between changes for synthetic oil?
I always thought it was supposed to be 10,000 miles?

Wow that's cool. :cool: I didn't even know they made synthetic oil thirty years ago. :red:

Look it up, yes they did

You will find that Mobil 1 Synthetics hit the market in the early / mid 70's.:smile:

What is the milage between changes for synthetic oil?
I always thought it was supposed to be 10,000 miles?


It varies by manufacture. There are some extended synthetics that they say can be used up to 25k. But you need to read the fine print on these. You will find that most will tell you you can change the oil at 25k but you need to replace the filter every 5k and add a quart (or what ever you lost replacing the filter). A 10k oil and filter change is not uncommon with synthetics. I've just always used 7k for mine and it's worked out for me. - Dan

I believe you. :bow:

I believe you. :bow:

Yeah, some of us old farts started using it when they were first introduced by Mobil 1 in the 70's. But I think there may have been synthetics used in other industries before being introduced as an automotive engine oil.

Your dealer is pretty much on the money with this information. Vehicles can run a lot longer on an oil change today than years past. The reason for this is a multitude of things. For one, engines are built a lot better today than in years past. For another, oils today are much better than they were in the past and have much better additives so they don't break down as rapidly. Then you toss synthetics into the mix and they're way more superior than fossil oils, so this even allows for more miles between changes, (some even have a 25,000 mile change recommendation). And today's filters are much better also.

I managed a fleet of 7,000+ vehicles here in Florida until I retired. Many years ago we went to a 12 month 7,500 mile oil and filter interval on our entire world wide fleet of 175,000 vehicles (all american made). We have never lost an engine due to an oil failure related issue and although I'm retired now the fleet continues to use this schedule and is a growing fleet. Ant these vehicles ALL use fossil oil and where available they use re-refined oil.

Many people involved in the oil industry have recommended 3k and 5k oil change intervals, the only thing this interval serves is to put money into their pockets. These intervals are only needed for severe use vehicles like taxi's, Police, etc.

Take a hard look at what most manufactures are now recommending, many are now recommending oil and filter changes in the 7k area.

Another thing to consider. What's the hardest thing on an engine that causes most of the wear? It's called a dry start. Now think about this for a minute, the more often you drain your crankcase to change the oil, the better the opportunity your engine will have for a dry start condition.

I've been using the 7k interval on my cars for over 30 years and have never had an oil related issue with any of my cars. We put 250,000 miles on my wifes 91 Ford festiva and when we finally traded it in for something a bit larger the dealer about flipped when he read the speedometer, and the engine still purred like a kitten. One of the salesmen actually bought the car from the dealership for his daughter to drive to school.

Keep in mind that I only use M-1 Synthetic oil and have been now for about 30 years or so.

BTW: Just to let you know. I mentioned above that I retired as a fleet manager but I didn't alway's do that. I was at one point a wrench turner for a living and have been certified by GM (GM Training Center, New Oleans, LA) in Delco Air Conditioning, Brakes, Engine Repair / Overhaul and Servicing, and Automatic Transmissions Repair / Overhaul and Servicing. Although I gave up being a mechanic for management several years ago, I've continued this on my own as a hot rodder / engine builder. I've rebuilt many engines for people over the years for both street and race cars. For the street car owners I recommend using the 7k interval as well, and so far I've never had an engine come back for failure.

Ok cool thanks for the info...I myself did question what i was being told....i was like what the heck is this guy talking about lol...but it says it in the owners manual to....So what i plan to do is when oil life gets below 20% ill have it changed....:smile:

I BELIEVE!!!! :lol:

LOL, you guy's crack me up...haha

OK, so well I lied to you .... a little.

I said I started using synthetics when they first appeared on the market. True

At the time I was using Kendall GT racing oil and I swore by this stuff. So when the synthetics hit the market I tried it. Well my oil pressure was lower using the synthetics Vs the Kendall GT oil so I switched back. I kept going back and forth between the two (myself being hung up on...more pressure must be better). After more information became available on the synthetic stuff I found out because it flow's better and is slipperier (sp), it will cause a little less oil pressure. At this point I switched for good and never looked back.

Ok cool thanks for the info...I myself did question what i was being told....i was like what the heck is this guy talking about lol...but it says it in the owners manual to....So what i plan to do is when oil life gets below 20% ill have it changed....:smile:

Keep in mind that the GM oil reminder keeps track of your driving habits as well as miles, engine oil temps, ambient temps, and other info to determine when it's time to change oil. I doesn't solely rely on miles. This information is used to calculate the life of the oil. But remember, this is based on fossil oil, not synthetics. So it will tell you when it's time for an oil change based on this very sophisticated data. One person may get 10- 12k before it's time to change oil, and another may only get 3 - 6k, but in either senario the oil reminder will determine when it's time based on the data. If your using synthetics you can most likely add at least a few thousand miles or a couple months to the recommendation and still be in great shape. GM put a lot of research into the oil reminders developement and it's actually a pretty good system.

Wow this became a popular thread. Since its started i've had 4 oil changes and I have close to 13,500 miles now.

Wow this became a popular thread. Since its started i've had 4 oil changes and I have close to 13,500 miles now.

Hell, I'm even thinking of changing the oil in my muffler bearings at this point...LOL

:laughabov :rof: :laughabov

I use Moblie 1 in my 03 tiburon, but now that I have a conection for Amsoil thats where I go. They are both the best oil as far as I'm concerned. :bow: :one: You sure can feel the differnce in it from the dealer pump oil. I think its time for me to swap out the tranny oil now too. Dan-D I think I can trust you on when you think you can swap out the factory tranny oil. I have about 8000 mile on it now. What do you think?:smile:

:laughabov :rof: :laughabov

I use Moblie 1 in my 03 tiburon, but now that I have a conection for Amsoil thats where I go. They are both the best oil as far as I'm concerned. :bow: :one: You sure can feel the differnce in it from the dealer pump oil. I think its time for me to swap out the tranny oil now too. Dan-D I think I can trust you on when you think you can swap out the factory tranny oil. I have about 8000 mile on it now. What do you think?:smile:

With 8k on her now you can reast easy about swapping out the tranny lube. I only have about 3k on mine and I'm about ready to replace my tranny lube out for some synchromeh GM stuff. (I don't have an oil connection..LOL).

Wow.... all this is getting almost confusing.
I've always run regular old Quaker State 10-30 in my cars and never had any problems. Now you guys have got me thinking about synthetics and the oil life guage and a whole bunch of other stuff. I think my head is going to crack.

Wow.... all this is getting almost confusing.
I've always run regular old Quaker State 10-30 in my cars and never had any problems. Now you guys have got me thinking about synthetics and the oil life guage and a whole bunch of other stuff. I think my head is going to crack.

Well when it comes to oils and oil filters there is a lot of schools of thought on the subject. Some people research and experiment with different things while others follow family tradition and do what they were taught from their dad or other influence. None of the information gathered here or anywhere for that matter is absolute gospel. A lot of what a person uses or doesn't use is based on experience or the lack there of. None of this is right or wrong, it just is.

One thing for sure, i'll never put Quaker State in anything...period.

I bought a 70 1/2 Z-28 back in 72 with only 36k on it. The car ran great. I decided to do some upgrades. I bought a new cam and lifters and was planning to do the swap out shortly (in a couple weeks) after I bought it. The first thing I did was replacd the Quaker State oil (the original owner used Quaker State since day one). I replaced the oil with Kendall GT racing oil which at the time I swore by. Now keep in mind, I had been driving the car for about a week before I decided to change the oil. During this time myself and racing buddies didn't notice any tail pipe smoking at all. Well to get to the point, after the oil and filter change I decided to take the car for a test drive to make sure there wasn't any leaks etc. I had a friend with a jet black 69 Chevelle follow behind me to watch for any smoking etc. We pulled over and I asked him if he saw any smoke, he said there was a tiny hint of smoke when I accellerated. We went back out and this time I showered down on the throttle, what I saw in the rear view was shocking. All I could see was oil smoke, it was so thick that I couldn't see my buddies black Chevell through it.

From that point on the car just continued to smoke. We took the car home and immediately yanked out the engine and tore it down. Shocker #2 came when we pulled off the valve covers and intake manifold. Everything on the top inside was covered in a thick layer of sludge, some areas only about 1/8", but others up to about 1/2" and the stuff was starting to come off in lumps.

Keep in mind, this engine had only 36k on it. Andy, the original owner did confess that although he ran QS oil from day one, he only changed it three times in the 36k. But even at that it shouldn't have sludged up like that. BTW: He used 10w30 oil.

Well needless to say, my cam change became a complete rebuild.

After that I swore I'd never use Quaker State oil.

Low...
Don't 2nd guess yourself... there's nothing wrong with good 'ol fossil oil!!! Your QS choice is fine, however... synthetic's just a little better at doing the job.
For fear of getting flamed (*DISCLAIMER* I'm not an 'Oil Expert' by any means...) or creating another 'Great Oil Debate' of which is best and why... let's just use a blanket statement and say it's *better* in more ways than one- although individuals generally have strong opinions one way or another for or against it.
Will it increase power? It's debatable... but (IMO) "Yes"... by freeing up rotating components. Can you feel a difference... (again, IMO) "No" - but I don't own a dyno. Is it worth the additional cost at every change? That's up to you...
Simply sticking to the basics will keep everything running fine for a long time.

Remember WE CHOSE to purchase the HHR over a "Loser" :thumb: ...although I'm sure there's someone out there (not on THIS board) that would argue in favor of a PT...Geessh- THE NERVE!!!

No, but once you go synthetic you probably will not want to go back.

For about the last 20 years I've been using an oil additive called "Tufoil" in my vehicles. You can check it out at: www.fluoramics.com
They make some fantastic claims which seem to be verified as true.
It's not cheap but you only use 8 oz. initially, then 4 oz. with each oil change afterward. On new engines they say not to use their product until you've got 5000 Miles on it. I'm coming up on 6000 miles and oil change time.
So I'll be starting to use it in the HHR then.:thumb:
:hhr: is :one:

Why cant I every get lucky. $21.95 for my oil change from the dealer.
You think that's bad? It cost me $28.91 for my first oil change back in January! $2.12 a qt. for the oil, $4.28 for the filter, and $12.87 labor.
btw: I'm an ex- Staten Islander, been gone since 1949/50.

I have 3800 miles on te HHR and the oil life meter says life @73%
I would usually change the first oil @ 3500 what is the suggested wait on the first than subsequent cganges/
Thanks
ducman

I have 3800 miles on te HHR and the oil life meter says life @73%
I would usually change the first oil @ 3500 what is the suggested wait on the first than subsequent cganges/
Thanks
ducman

Personally I usually do my first oil change at 500 miles using fossil oil, and then in another 500 miles I again change it this time using M1 synthetic. Why you ask...heck, I don't know. It's a carry over of old habits before synthetics were widely available. After that I go to my routine 7k interval.

I did something a bit different on my HHR. I didn't do the usual 500 mile change and instead waited till it hit 1k, at this point I changed it to M1 synthetic. I'll change it again at 4k, and then I'll go to my regular 7k interval.

I did something a bit different on my HHR. I didn't do the usual 500 mile change and instead waited till it hit 1k, at this point I changed it to M1 synthetic. I'll change it again at 4k, and then I'll go to my regular 7k interval.

Funny how brilliant minds think alike Dan! :lol:

I did the exact same thing! :D

Funny how brilliant minds think alike Dan! :lol:

I did the exact same thing! :D

Maybe we'll start a new trend...:lol:

Changed oil yesterday at 3500 miles. DIC said there was 64% oil life left.:D

I'm gonig to be putting close to 2000 miles on it this weekend so I figured I'd get it done now.:steering: Bristol Motor Speedway here we come!!:thumb:

Used Valvoline's synthetic oil. First time I ever used a synthetic.

From here on out though I'll be going by what the DIC says.:smile:

I did mine at 1060 miles and used Mobil One. I have 1331 on it now and will change it again at 5000. Easiest change I've ever done. Nothing but synthetic oil from now on. :smile:

I checked the filter and I didn't see any metal chips either. :smile:

Ray

the dealership where i bought mine has this addative that they put in all oil changes that bumps the oil change price up to nearly 40 bucks. Im taking mine to another dealership

I have also noticed that the gas mileage tends to go down towards the end of an oil change. Or that could be that im using the AC any time the HHR is cranked now because its so hot now. or could be both. Either way monday im getting an oil change.

Okay Guys & Gals....Did the 1st oil change last night...2.4 engine with 1006 miles on it....Put in a new Purolator Pure 1 Oil Filter(only because I couldn't find an AC-Delco filter after stopping at 3 stores) and 5 qts. of Mobil 1 Full Synthetic 5W-30..and drove for about 5 miles last night after the oil change...Started the HHR this morning to go to work and the lifters or bearings rattled to beat hell for about 5 sec's, about the time it would take for full pressure....Never had this happen on the HHR before changing the oil:eek: ......Your thoughts!!!!

I would just keep an eye (ear) on it, it doesn't sound good. I'm using the same oil and filter your using and haven't had any noise at all. The Pure-1 oil filter is supposed to be one of the best on the market today and you can never go wrong with M-1 oil. Keep us posted on what it is or isn't doing as time goes by.

I also have the 2.4 and heard a little noise at first start after the change but its takes a second or two for full lubrication. Its been extremely quiet ever since.

Ray

I also have the 2.4 and heard a little noise at first start after the change but its takes a second or two for full lubrication. Its been extremely quiet ever since.

Ray

That's the funny thing about this....When I first changed it, and started it back up, that's when you might expect to hear a little rattle.....not the next day...Thanks for the replies.

......Your thoughts!!!!

Piece 'o junk 4-banger......sell it! :lol:

:D

Well I still have the lifter rattle:cry: at start up after she sits for 6+ hours....Taking it to the dealer Monday night so they can start it up cold Tuesday morning.....Let you know what I find out

Don't waste your time Sam, cancel the appointment...let's toss a BIG BLOCK in that baby! :D

http://www.gearheadplanet.com/shop/images/blown.gif

Bye, bye lifter rattle, (well, for the most part!)

Don't waste your time Sam, cancel the appointment...let's toss a BIG BLOCK in that baby! :D

http://www.gearheadplanet.com/shop/images/blown.gif

Bye, bye lifter rattle, (well, for the most part!)


Well then damn it,,,,,I'd have to go ahead and tub it...10 pt cage, get rid of the rear side doors and everything:thumb: .......Think that would VOID the warranty????:lol:

So Sam.....what are you doing this weekend? :lol:

Wanna come over? :D

No more lifter rattle after the HHR sits over night........So I'm cancelling my appointment at the Dealer.......Still strange that it did that for 2 days after changing the oil......Well I'm off to Eldora Speedway :thumb: to watch some Sprint races.........

When you say the oil filter is easy to get to from the top, do you have to remove anything, such as the air filter housing? Thanks in advance, MIKE

When you say the oil filter is easy to get to from the top, do you have to remove anything, such as the air filter housing? Thanks in advance, MIKE

Nope, you just simply remove the cap and pull out the filter element.

A quick note about synthetic oil use. DO NOT USE SYNTHETIC IN AN ENGINE THAT ALREADY HAS OIL LEAKS!! The synthetic oil will only make it worse. Lab created oil (Synthetic) has identical size molecules other than fossil oils that can vary. The synthetic oil will break down the sludge that is holding together what is left from the gasket due the cleaning additives it contains. This information I received from a very boring Castrol Syntec Meeting I attended a couple of years back. Dan-D is correct about the lifespan of oil, today oils outperform oils of 5 years ago.

In my opinion use Castrol Syntec… Only if you cannot afford Mobile 1 Synthetic Oil :one:

When I worked on a race team a few years ago we did some playing around with oils and found that using Mobile 1 would increase the horsepower in a pavement latemodel engine (355ci, 350 brl holley,around 360hp, 410 ft lbs tourque) 4 to 6 hp. We were sponsered by synergyn oil (dyson oil co, racing oil) depending on the used we could get around 12 hp using it.

Interesting reading.

I think I'll be switching to syntehtic as well (that is once I get the HHR).

Just to verify, no changes need to be made to the DIC settings when switching from fossil to synthetic, correct?

When I was a Triumph Motorcycle Tech we used Mobile 1 Tri-Synthenic oil, after the break in period of 500 miles.

One thing for sure, i'll never put Quaker State in anything...period.



+1

not good oil...

As far as the oil changes go... is it recommended to change the oil the first time at or around 1K miles..?? I always fill the new filter with oil before I put it on... anyone else do that..??

Its good to prime the filter. It helps against dry starts

Its good to prime the filter. It helps against dry starts

I always prime a screw on cannister filter, but I don't know how well this would work with the HHR drop in cartridge. It may, I'll have to check it out the next time I change my oil. Didn't even think about it the last (and only time) I changed my oil.

If I remember right most canister filter there is some oil in the "cylinder" where you would drop i the filter. My buddies dad cleans the oil out before he add the new filter in his BMW. He also primes it as well.

If I remember right most canister filter there is some oil in the "cylinder" where you would drop i the filter. My buddies dad cleans the oil out before he add the new filter in his BMW. He also primes it as well.

The HHR doesn't use a canister filter, it uses a drop in cartridge. But even at that I'm sure the oil pick up has a check valve so the system doesn't lose it's prime. So I would imagine adding oil to the cartridge recess should work in lessening the chance of a dry start.
:thumb:

Hey Ya'll I figured I would throw a wrench in the fan just for the heck of it. Here goes:

Castrol Syntec full synthetic is not full synthetic oil... It is composed primarily of group III base stocks, which the government says can be labled sythetic. Basically, they take petroleum base stocks, and "treat" them at high temps/chemicals/presure to change the molecular structure.

That said, Castrol Syntec FS is darn good oil. The difference in say it and Mobil 1 or Pennzoil Platinum is the base stock. These two oils use group IV and group V stocks. What this means in the real world is that these oils are slightly more resistant to sheering - the reduction in molecule length, and subsequent thining of the oil.

Here is another wrench - Changing your oil at 3000 miles has the potential to do more damage than changing your oil at 5000 miles.

Here is why - Oil wears out in several ways. The first is shearing, mentioned above. Another is accumulation of non-soluable particles. These are usually the result of oil burn off. Your filter attempts to remove these from the oil. The third, and most significant wear factor is the depletion of additive. As oil is run through an engine, its additives, which are dispersants (detergents), anti-oxidants, and anti-wear additives, are gradually consumed in the function of their duties. This was mentioned earlier in the thread while discussing the oil life meter.

This is significant because any oil that is specified for use in the HHR will not be at the end of its usefull life at 3000 miles, nor at the end 5000 miles. The engine danger comes in during the process of changing the oil. It adds the component of human mistakes - not adding enough or the correct replacement oil, not replaceing the drain plug or not tightening it to specs. Any one of these mistakes may significantly shorten engine life. It also adds the factor of a longer than usual startup period without oil pressure. This does cause engine wear. My suggestion would be to follow the manufacturers reccomendation for oil change interval.

Here is another wrench

5w-30 is better than 10w-30........... in this application.

I know there are alot of people out there that have used 10w-30 for 40 years, and by golly they ain't nothin wrong with it. That is true, except this engine was not designed to use 10w-30. It has very narrow oil gallery passages. The dangers lies in cold engine starts. A 10 weight oil is thicker than a 5 weight oil, obviously. The thicker the oil, the harder it is to pump when cold, and the slower it moves through the lubrication system. This leads to the possibility of engine wear. If you must use a 10w-30 oil, then at least be sure it meets the GM cold pumping spec.

I know the story about the only reason for lighter weight oil is for CAFE numbers, and that is partially true. Lighter oil increases fuel economy. But in this case, it also protects your motor more thoroughly.

What oil do I use in my HHR?

I use Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30

Why? Cuz it is cheaper than Mobil 1 and shows just as good used oil analysis as Mobil 1. I change as indicated by the OLM, and it is still over-kill as far as oil change intervals go. It is going about 13,500 miles between changes - lots of highway driving.

Feel free to disagree, thats why I threw the wrench. Dialogue is good, and ya'll are pretty darn easy to get along with:smile:

A lot of what you said I can support based on my own research and M1 is my choice of oil. I support your decision on using Castrol because of the cost difference between it and M1....smart choice...maybe, the sad part is that there are many people using the much higher priced Royal Purple and Amsoil and my research tells me that the only benefit is to the oil companies in green from the end users pocket. I've been using M1 now for about 30 years and have always subscribed to the 75 - 10k oil change intervals and have never had a problem, and your right in that shorter intervals will increase your chances of a dry start condition and the automotive industry has already proven that this is the the primary cause of engine bearing wear and failure. Like you I prefer using 5w30 oil. Thanks for your input...now we're both gonna get flamed. -Dan:thumb:

Shakakan, Dan-d,

I'm with you guys too. Quailty oil (M1 in my case) and filter at a 10K interval. That's how it works in my garage. :thumb:

Shakakan, Dan-d,

I'm with you guys too. Quailty oil (M1 in my case) and filter at a 10K interval. That's how it works in my garage. :thumb:

Nice to hear from you in this regard.

What strikes me is those who ***** about the current gas prices and still subscribe to the very short oil change intervals, don't these people realize the $$$$ is going into the same pockets.

The old 3 months/3000 miles rule has been driven in my head so long it is tough not to follow, but starting with my HHR I decided to go with Mobil 1 Synthetic and go by the OLM, starting at 1000 miles. I got to 7500 miles with an OLM reading of 50% and got nervous enough to change the oil. I am up to 15,000 miles now with an OLM reading of 60% and the nervous feelings are coming back. It's hard to let it go this long when I have been told so long don't go over 3000 miles or risk damage to the engine. I guess I'll keep fighting the feeling and wait. I check the oil often, and it doesn't look all that dirty, and the vast majority of my driving is highway, so I hope I'm dong the right thing.

Mizzou: It may put your mind at ease to have a used oil analysis done at your next oil change. This will give you an idea of how your oil is holding up, and will inform you of any abnormal wear taking place.

The old 3 months/3000 miles rule has been driven in my head so long it is tough not to follow, but starting with my HHR I decided to go with Mobil 1 Synthetic and go by the OLM, starting at 1000 miles. I got to 7500 miles with an OLM reading of 50% and got nervous enough to change the oil. I am up to 15,000 miles now with an OLM reading of 60% and the nervous feelings are coming back. It's hard to let it go this long when I have been told so long don't go over 3000 miles or risk damage to the engine. I guess I'll keep fighting the feeling and wait. I check the oil often, and it doesn't look all that dirty, and the vast majority of my driving is highway, so I hope I'm dong the right thing.


mizzouHHR

I know what you mean. I was brought up on the 3000 mile cycle with my Dad. When the odometer would read over 3000 between oil changes I somehow felt I was letting him down.

I also just like to change the oil it always makes me feel like I just did something "good" for my car's engine. It also always seemed to run better, but I know that is all in my head. I am trying very hard to resist changing my oil since we returned from our 2200 mile summer vacation and so far so good. I am also using Mobil 1 and I check the oil often.

Maybe we should start an “Oil Changers Anonymous Group” that provides support for each other. :lol:

I am going to let the oil in until at least 7500, but like you, I know I will be tempted. I already have the Mobil 1 and filter sitting in the garage. I appreciate all of the support I have received and if I backslide I will let you know.

WOW I cant belive how long this tread has been around. I allready have 15,700 miles and i'm up to my 5th oil change.

A lot of what you said I can support based on my own research and M1 is my choice of oil. I support your decision on using Castrol because of the cost difference between it and M1....smart choice...
Any concerns about the latest news that M1 may no longer be a true synthetic and that Group III oil has supposedly been found in the newer batches?

If true, it would be rather embarassing for Mobil 1 considering the stink they raised about Castrol in the late 90s. But the M1 vs Castrol issue was before Exxon entered the picture.

As for cost of M1 versus Castol, I found a good deal today. I picked up 5.4 litres of M1 5w30 Synthetic for $29.66 CDN at Wal-Mart (normally $37 for 5 litres). I can get 6 litres of Castrol Syntec 5w30 at Costco for $33.

I'm a bit timid about changing the oil myself at the moment (also lacking the equipment to do it right now), I still need to find someone I can trust to change the oil for me.

I have found the HHR to be the easiest car I have ever had to change the oil. The filter is easily accessible from the top and the drain plug is easy to get to without raising the car.
I looked under the beast as best I could and did not see the drain plug, but I was not able to lay down completely.

Is it on the front side of the motor or the back side?

I use Amsoil full syn. Sure noticed a difference going from the dealer pump oil to that. Fuel milage is up, engine runs a little cooler and noticed a little peper car. Love this oil. I even get it cheap. My brother is a Amsoil dealer.:smile: :thumb:
what wt amsoil do you use and do you use the amsoil filter if so what is the number , btw yes i just got our HHR friday :smile:

One thing that I am a bit concerned about is the OLM and the use of synthetic oil. Since the OLM doesn't actually come in contact with the oil, it doesn't know what type of oil is being used so it can't "adjust" itself to know that better oil is being used.

Since the OLM takes into consideration temps, driving habits, etc, it will likely still tell you to change the oil at the same time it would using dino oil, even though with the synthetic oil you could go for longer OCIs, thus resulting in spending more money on oil than necessary.

For example, my HHR was built on March 3rd (no idea when the 2.4L motor was assembled and filled) and still has the factory fill oil in it. Oil is at least 9 months old. I've had the HHR 2 months and have 4,300 kms on it. The OLM has dropped 37% in the two months I've had it (now at 61% - was at 98% when we got it). I am tempted to change the oil out at 5,000 kms anyway since the oil is "old".

Some folks I talked to recommended that I do one more fill with dino oil before going the synthetic route (likely Syntec since I can get it at a good price compared to M1).

Any comments on my rambling commentray? :lol:

Some folks I talked to recommended that I do one more fill with dino oil before going the synthetic route (likely Syntec since I can get it at a good price compared to M1).

Stick with dino oil until you hit at least 12000 miles (I believe that's 8000km). Main reasoning for this is that your engine is still considered to be in break-in until this odometer range, and synthetic oil, while being a really good lubricant, will not allow the pistons to seat properly into the cylinder walls. Conversely, although a lot of folks will argue with this one, in general you should stop using synthetic and go back to dino oil when you hit 100,000 miles (140,000km) because of the properties of synthetic oil being a smaller molecule than dino oil: it will on occasion blow past parts without even lubricating them in older engines, as their tolerances grow wider.

I agree with you 100% When I worked at an oil change shop. I attended a Castrol Motor Oil seminar. One of the topics they brought up was do not use synthetic oil in an engine with Any sign of an oil leak. The same reason Desert Coyote brought up about the molecules in syn oil. Another thing synthetic oil has is detergents to clean the inside of the engines crank case. So the sludge in your engine holding the gasket together will get cleaned out and you will have an oil leak. Most synthetic oils have a lifespan of 5,000 to 7,500 miles before any signs of breakdown. Its better to change the oil around that time frame before the oil is completely broken down, so you still have protection of engine wear. This my :2cents:

I took the HHR in for it's first oil change today.

$46.00 for an oil change at the dealership :roll:

I'll be doing it myself after this.

If you go from synthetic back to normal oil on some engines you will experience a tapping noise for a while. I run castrol full synthetic in my 2.4 hhr and have 32,000 miles on and had no problems at all.

If you go from synthetic back to normal oil on some engines you will experience a tapping noise for a while. I run castrol full synthetic in my 2.4 hhr and have 32,000 miles on and had no problems at all.
I have the tapping noise now on my second fill of dino (only 5,000 kms on the motor so far). The tapping noise was there with the factory fill oil as well. Can't really tell if it's the valvetrain or perhaps the injectors. I only hear it inside the car, not with the hood popped open.

I've got a couple of jugs of Pennzoil Platinum full synthetic just waiting to go into my HHR.

hmm maybe im messing up my ride...
my D I C read 8% life and i had 10,000 miles on it... think thats too long for the oil change??? i went by what ppl said on here, to go by the DIC thing and change it when it says so, so i changed it at 10,000 miles...

10,000 seems way too long for change. I usually change mine per the computer but I thought it was more like 5,000 miles. Maybe it sense the way the engine is run and bases it off that. Mine normally is 0 life at 5,000.

Interesting El-Rey....

How is your car driven...highway usage, city, long "runs", etc.

But, the DIC report of an oil change IS BASED on how a vehicle is driven. The owners book provides info on this.

Also, I know a guy who has very high mileage on his HHR, which is driven almost exclusively across this country (up state NY to AZ)on a routine basis. He's getting 9000-10000 miles on his also.:thumb:

Mine would go to 10,000 but i change it at 3,000. Last month onstar report right after I changed it at17,500 said my next one would be due at 27,500. I do't think so it will be changed at 20,500. I don't know a mechanic that goes over 3,000, but to each his own.

tomdent,

I can name about ~30 mechanics who exceed 3000 oci. The OLM on our HHR is currently indicating about 12000, it has gone down a bit as it has been colder.

As to the news about M1 now containing large amounts of Group III stocks, that doesn't bother me. What is concerning is the poor UOAs that this oil has been showing. They have been significantly poorer since the change in formulation. I am now firmly entrenched with my Penn Platinum. This oil has a large amount of Group III stocks, but the UOAs have been awesome with it. As a side note, I am using tropartic 5-W30 in my Honda. 1.68 a quart, and great UOAs

Also, Pennzoil Platinum is very cost effective (and good syn oil).

For the US folks, Advance Auto Parts right now is having a BOGO event (Buy 1 get 1 free) on Pennzoil Platinum.

Interesting El-Rey....

How is your car driven...highway usage, city, long "runs", etc.

But, the DIC report of an oil change IS BASED on how a vehicle is driven. The owners book provides info on this.

Also, I know a guy who has very high mileage on his HHR, which is driven almost exclusively across this country (up state NY to AZ)on a routine basis. He's getting 9000-10000 miles on his also.:thumb:

pretty much very short trips, to work and back, about 2 mles round trip, and if not, it usually is hi-way miles..so i guess im OK:thumb:

Just took my car in for its first oil change. Mileage=4997 and Oil Life=50%. Had a belt noise so since I was taking it in had the oil changed as well. Cost of oil change service=$31.14. Have a bad belt and the part has to be ordered. Got in the car and checked the DIC to see if they reset the Oil Life and nope they didn't. After 2 service men they got it reset back to 100%.

I'm at about 3500 miles and the OLM states about 58%. That tells me about 9K for the change. I will not wait that long. I will be putting M1 in at 5K and see how it goes then. I did go 10K on the wifes Mazda with M1 in it and it was not black when I drained it. But I was nervious about it.:cool: In the past I had been doing it at 5K and just wanted to see what it looked like at 10K.

I got a brochure from the dealer about their "service" agreements -$51.95 for an oil change and "suggested" services every 3000 miles. I think that I will go back to my old place $30 - $40 depending on type of oil (regular or synthetic). ;)

"In 2006, the results of a gas chromatography test on Mobil 1 EP 5w-30 were posted by an industry expert on the popular motor oil discussion website BITOG. It showed the oil to be primarily composed of a less expensive, Group III hydroprocessed mineral oil. Until this time, Mobil 1 was believed to be a true synthetic, utilizing a Group IV (PAO) basestock. The release of this information has led to a backlash against ExxonMobil's lubricant products in many automotive communities.

Ironically, in 1999, Mobil fought Castrol's change in formulation to a Group III basestock in motor oils being marketed as fully synthetic. Mobil claimed that Castrol was decieving their customer base, while degrading their products. The National Advertising Division of the Council of Better Business Bureaus eventually ruled that Castrol could continue to market their Syntec line as a fully synthetic motor oil. ExxonMobil currently refuses to comment on the primary basestock of their Mobil 1 series of oils."

http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:K2I8nd2BJX4J:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobil+mobil+1+controversy&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us&client=safari