Mass Air Flow part
08-08-2013, 04:14 PM
#1
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Join Date: 08-08-2013
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 25
Mass Air Flow part
Hi everyone!
Last year I purchased a Certified Pre-Owned 2010 HHR LT and have had all sorts of minor issues with it. Granted, my warranty is covering a lot, but I had to pay over $400 for new tires as they sent me off with #4 (darned near bald) tires. That was a lesson to learn about buying used!
Anyway, on Sunday, the check engine light kept coming on and off. I checked the gas cap and nothing would change. Then I'd turn on the car again and no check engine light. Then on again.
Then while sitting at stop signs, the car would rock and sputter like it was running out of gas.
I just called the dealer after dropping off last night and he wasn't at his desk and said he was waiting for parts. I love this guy, but he's super busy. Anyway, he said one of the parts was a mass flow air something. What does that do and what other parts might he need?
Also, after the new tires they aligned the car because it pulled left, and he showed me the readings, but the car still pulls left. What else could cause that?
So far, the car has been back to the dealer four times in the year I've had it. I'm really angry at the term "Certified Pre-Owned", because they didn't do a darned thing to my car before selling it to me (not even change the oil). They've just honored the warranty when I asked them to (except for the tires). What else in their 125 point inspection could they have neglected?? Or did I just get a lemon?
Last year I purchased a Certified Pre-Owned 2010 HHR LT and have had all sorts of minor issues with it. Granted, my warranty is covering a lot, but I had to pay over $400 for new tires as they sent me off with #4 (darned near bald) tires. That was a lesson to learn about buying used!
Anyway, on Sunday, the check engine light kept coming on and off. I checked the gas cap and nothing would change. Then I'd turn on the car again and no check engine light. Then on again.
Then while sitting at stop signs, the car would rock and sputter like it was running out of gas.
I just called the dealer after dropping off last night and he wasn't at his desk and said he was waiting for parts. I love this guy, but he's super busy. Anyway, he said one of the parts was a mass flow air something. What does that do and what other parts might he need?
Also, after the new tires they aligned the car because it pulled left, and he showed me the readings, but the car still pulls left. What else could cause that?
So far, the car has been back to the dealer four times in the year I've had it. I'm really angry at the term "Certified Pre-Owned", because they didn't do a darned thing to my car before selling it to me (not even change the oil). They've just honored the warranty when I asked them to (except for the tires). What else in their 125 point inspection could they have neglected?? Or did I just get a lemon?
08-08-2013, 04:29 PM
#2
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Join Date: 04-09-2006
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 7,032
Welcome, welcome, welcome!!!!! 
Re: "Mass flow air something" - that is likely the Mass Air Flow sensor (also known as the MAF) - it senses the amount of air entering the engine and is used to calibrate the air/fuel mixture. It is a component that sometimes gets contaminated and sometimes a cleaning will restore it's function. Often it is just replaced, so it does not come-back on the mechanic if a cleaning doesn't work that well. You can read up on it here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_flow_sensor
Re: "car pulling left" - did it pull left prior to the new tires being installed? Hopefully they will be looking at it again while in the shop?
Tip for you: posting the CEL code here really helps narrow down what the problem is caused by. But be aware that often the CEL code may point to a specific component, but the cause may be related to something other than that component. Kind of the nature of the beast.
If the issues continue, you always have the option of escalating to the service or sales managers at the dealership. Just keep things well documented at your end.
Re: "Mass flow air something" - that is likely the Mass Air Flow sensor (also known as the MAF) - it senses the amount of air entering the engine and is used to calibrate the air/fuel mixture. It is a component that sometimes gets contaminated and sometimes a cleaning will restore it's function. Often it is just replaced, so it does not come-back on the mechanic if a cleaning doesn't work that well. You can read up on it here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_flow_sensor
Re: "car pulling left" - did it pull left prior to the new tires being installed? Hopefully they will be looking at it again while in the shop?
Tip for you: posting the CEL code here really helps narrow down what the problem is caused by. But be aware that often the CEL code may point to a specific component, but the cause may be related to something other than that component. Kind of the nature of the beast.
If the issues continue, you always have the option of escalating to the service or sales managers at the dealership. Just keep things well documented at your end.
08-08-2013, 04:38 PM
#3
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Join Date: 08-08-2013
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 25
Thank you for the nice welcome.
Okay, you got me. What is a CEL code? Is that when you look up the codes yourself?
Yes, the car pulled left with the bad tires. They replaced the tires and realigned, but it still goes left. And yes, they are looking at it again.
So the MAF is part of the fuel system, which is why it felt like it was running out of gas...I get it. He said there was another part too, but off the top of his head he couldn't remember. I have to call him back in 20 to see if he can put me in another car today, because the car won't be done. Sigh.
He IS the service manager. He has never questioned me and has always fixed it. It's the SALES manager I don't trust. I don't see how you can sell a certified pre-owned without doing anything to it. Oh well, live and learn. I told the service manager that I didn't want to see the car until I never had to bring it back again. Hopefully, he'll give it a good once over. When I get there today (if they have a car for me), I'm going to grill him.
Any other clues why it might pull to the left? Could it be the sway bar?
Yes, the car pulled left with the bad tires. They replaced the tires and realigned, but it still goes left. And yes, they are looking at it again.
So the MAF is part of the fuel system, which is why it felt like it was running out of gas...I get it. He said there was another part too, but off the top of his head he couldn't remember. I have to call him back in 20 to see if he can put me in another car today, because the car won't be done. Sigh.
He IS the service manager. He has never questioned me and has always fixed it. It's the SALES manager I don't trust. I don't see how you can sell a certified pre-owned without doing anything to it. Oh well, live and learn. I told the service manager that I didn't want to see the car until I never had to bring it back again. Hopefully, he'll give it a good once over. When I get there today (if they have a car for me), I'm going to grill him.
Any other clues why it might pull to the left? Could it be the sway bar?
08-08-2013, 04:49 PM
#4
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Join Date: 01-23-2009
Location: Fredericksburg, Virginia
Posts: 24,691
All HHRs that I have driven tend to the left and the steering wheel is about 3 degrees turned left. One of these days I'm gonna pull the steering wheel off and put it on right.
My local dealer sold me a "Certified" HHR that had nearly been totalled. Nobody noticed the absence of paint on the fender bolts or the absence of insulation under the fenders. Any way the famous 125 point inspection is a BUNCH OF HOOEY. I will not back down from that statement, and it goes for any used car sales organization. If anything gets inspected it is so superficial as to not count, more like looked a in the general direction. Sorry, you got me started, I'll voluntarily stop now. (I already edited out a lot.)
My local dealer sold me a "Certified" HHR that had nearly been totalled. Nobody noticed the absence of paint on the fender bolts or the absence of insulation under the fenders. Any way the famous 125 point inspection is a BUNCH OF HOOEY. I will not back down from that statement, and it goes for any used car sales organization. If anything gets inspected it is so superficial as to not count, more like looked a in the general direction. Sorry, you got me started, I'll voluntarily stop now. (I already edited out a lot.)
08-08-2013, 04:52 PM
#5
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Join Date: 06-30-2010
Location: Kannapolis NC
Posts: 25,739
to the forum!A sway bar won't cause a pull, but the brakes can, also damaged/worn front end components.
Brakes can cause a pull to one side if you have one front brake that is dragging, it's commonly called a "hung caliper" meaning that the brake caliper isn't releasing fully. The can be caused by corroded caliper guides or a piston not retracting fully when the brakes are released.
Worn or bent suspension components can cause a pull, but I'd hope it would have been caught during the alignment.
Uneven tire pressures can cause a pull too.
08-08-2013, 04:53 PM
#6
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Join Date: 01-23-2009
Location: Fredericksburg, Virginia
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A CEL code is the OBDII code reading that a tech can pull off of the computer to find the reason for the CheckEngineLight on the dashboard.
I would bet that they changed the air filter and did not hook the MAF back up right.\
I would bet that they changed the air filter and did not hook the MAF back up right.\
08-08-2013, 05:00 PM
#7
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Join Date: 04-09-2006
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 7,032
and to further clarify: CEL = Check Engine Light in case you missed it - Like Donbrew says. :)
the codes are diagnostic, or trouble codes, such the ones listed here: https://www.chevyhhr.net/forums/problems-service-repairs-42/list-diagnostic-trouble-codes-2008-2010-hhr-14259/
the codes are diagnostic, or trouble codes, such the ones listed here: https://www.chevyhhr.net/forums/problems-service-repairs-42/list-diagnostic-trouble-codes-2008-2010-hhr-14259/
08-08-2013, 05:09 PM
#8
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Join Date: 08-08-2013
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You will get NO argument with me on that one, donbrew.
The service manager has basically let me know that he expects this from every used car they sell. You'd think it would just be easier to fix it first. I did get the carfax - if it can be trusted - and there are no recorded accidents. I chalk up the quick deterioration of parts to the fact it was a rental car.
Now I'm wondering if the brakes need replacement as well. HEAVY sigh.
Do I have to have one of those readers to look at the CEL codes?
Thank you for all your opinions and advice. Chevrolet should monitor these forums and do something about these dealers! My dealer is well known and considered reputable around these here parts, and they have fixed everything no charge (except the tires, arg). But this kind of stuff is underhanded!
The service manager has basically let me know that he expects this from every used car they sell. You'd think it would just be easier to fix it first. I did get the carfax - if it can be trusted - and there are no recorded accidents. I chalk up the quick deterioration of parts to the fact it was a rental car.
Now I'm wondering if the brakes need replacement as well. HEAVY sigh.
Do I have to have one of those readers to look at the CEL codes?
Thank you for all your opinions and advice. Chevrolet should monitor these forums and do something about these dealers! My dealer is well known and considered reputable around these here parts, and they have fixed everything no charge (except the tires, arg). But this kind of stuff is underhanded!
08-08-2013, 05:23 PM
#9
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Join Date: 06-30-2010
Location: Kannapolis NC
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You need what is called a "Scan Tool" to pull the codes, they range from relatively inexpensive to YIKES!! If you're not into a lot of DIY repair work and diagnostics, most auto parts stores will pull the codes for free and give you a printout.
Your brakes might need checked before you plan on replacing anything.
Chevy does monitor this forum, and in the past they have helped members out with servicing issues.
Your brakes might need checked before you plan on replacing anything.
Chevy does monitor this forum, and in the past they have helped members out with servicing issues.
08-08-2013, 05:50 PM
#10
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Join Date: 01-23-2009
Location: Fredericksburg, Virginia
Posts: 24,691
My Carfax was clean too, until 3 months after I bought it.
I just noticed, you had to buy new tires because the tires on the car were bad when you drove off the lot????? That's illegal in VA and I leap to assume CA also.
The main thing to know about buying a used car is they don't spend $0.0001 more than the must to move the car off of the lot. The other thing is that the new car sales the used car sales and the service operation are entirely different entities. My local Chevy General Manager (not General Sales Manager, the actual big guy) sent me to a local tire store to have my alignment checked after I voiced my concerns about my almost totalled front end.
If you really want to start something with them start by asking for $700 back because that's the "Certified" surcharge. Then escalate to the BBB, I had a check in my mailbox within 48 hours of my complaint.
You can go to the GM website to get a definition of "Certified Pre-Owned". They owe you tires at least.
I just noticed, you had to buy new tires because the tires on the car were bad when you drove off the lot????? That's illegal in VA and I leap to assume CA also.
The main thing to know about buying a used car is they don't spend $0.0001 more than the must to move the car off of the lot. The other thing is that the new car sales the used car sales and the service operation are entirely different entities. My local Chevy General Manager (not General Sales Manager, the actual big guy) sent me to a local tire store to have my alignment checked after I voiced my concerns about my almost totalled front end.
If you really want to start something with them start by asking for $700 back because that's the "Certified" surcharge. Then escalate to the BBB, I had a check in my mailbox within 48 hours of my complaint.
You can go to the GM website to get a definition of "Certified Pre-Owned". They owe you tires at least.