E85 Fuel Economy
11-06-2010, 03:39 PM
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: 01-04-2010
Location: Imported from Detroit
Posts: 1,584
But it does cut down on fossil fuel consumption.
11-06-2010, 06:31 PM
#22
New Member
Join Date: 07-14-2009
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 27
Ethanol has about 66% of the energy as gasoline based on the lower heating value (LHV). But in the manufacture of E85 what is called denatured ethanol is used. Which means it has been mixed with an unspecified amount of some other unspecified chemical to make it undrinkable, so I can't really say what it's exact LHV is. E85 contains 85% of this alcohol mix and 15% gasoline. The resulting LHV theoretically is about 71% that of straight gasoline. That means that you get 29% less energy when you burn it. Performance and fuel mileage both suffer accordingly.
There is no free lunch.
There is no free lunch.
11-06-2010, 09:41 PM
#23
Senior Member
Join Date: 01-04-2010
Location: Imported from Detroit
Posts: 1,584
That is correct. Remember, my screen name tells me a great deal about it, I work in the industry. So you're not telling me anything.
If gas is expensive, like $4 a gallon, and E85 is still down around $1.75, then even though you burn it way faster, you will still save money.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like the stuff. But there is a small place for it.
If gas is expensive, like $4 a gallon, and E85 is still down around $1.75, then even though you burn it way faster, you will still save money.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like the stuff. But there is a small place for it.
11-07-2010, 08:33 AM
#26
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Join Date: 09-13-2010
Location: Brew City
Posts: 745
Where did you get these figures from? Isn't the usual price spread between E85 and gas around 15-26% ? If I could find E85 that's 50-60% cheaper, I would definitely use it.
And since a car will become 30% less efficient on E85, I truly doubt that the price spread will ever exceed that. That's why ethanol is one big scam on consumers. Plus our food prices go up also.
11-07-2010, 08:24 PM
#27
New Member
Join Date: 07-14-2009
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 27
The LHV of LPG (propane) is about 72% of gasoline. Unless you're saving at least 28% in fuel costs then you're not getting a bargain there either. This assumes that you've already recouped the LPG conversion cost somehow.
11-08-2010, 10:51 AM
#28
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Join Date: 01-04-2010
Location: Imported from Detroit
Posts: 1,584
Don't worry, this time of the year with the rise of the RVP season, they're putting butane in your gas anyway.
I pulled those prices out of my arse. Honest. However, when gas prices do rise the E85 doesn't rise nearly as much. The spread can increase to make it worth the loss of efficiency.
But listen, I'm not all about it nor do I like it. But it has it's place. And trust me the E85 is not worry, look into the feds passing the laws for E15.
Oh and it should be noted that some of the tuners are setting up their cars to run on E85. I know a local guy that did that to his big power Subby, so he can get a consistently higher Octane.
Where did you get these figures from? Isn't the usual price spread between E85 and gas around 15-26% ? If I could find E85 that's 50-60% cheaper, I would definitely use it.
And since a car will become 30% less efficient on E85, I truly doubt that the price spread will ever exceed that. That's why ethanol is one big scam on consumers. Plus our food prices go up also.
And since a car will become 30% less efficient on E85, I truly doubt that the price spread will ever exceed that. That's why ethanol is one big scam on consumers. Plus our food prices go up also.
But listen, I'm not all about it nor do I like it. But it has it's place. And trust me the E85 is not worry, look into the feds passing the laws for E15.
Oh and it should be noted that some of the tuners are setting up their cars to run on E85. I know a local guy that did that to his big power Subby, so he can get a consistently higher Octane.
11-08-2010, 04:51 PM
#29
Senior Member
Join Date: 09-13-2010
Location: Brew City
Posts: 745
Don't worry, this time of the year with the rise of the RVP season, they're putting butane in your gas anyway.
I pulled those prices out of my arse. Honest. However, when gas prices do rise the E85 doesn't rise nearly as much. The spread can increase to make it worth the loss of efficiency.
But listen, I'm not all about it nor do I like it. But it has it's place. And trust me the E85 is not worry, look into the feds passing the laws for E15.
Oh and it should be noted that some of the tuners are setting up their cars to run on E85. I know a local guy that did that to his big power Subby, so he can get a consistently higher Octane.
I pulled those prices out of my arse. Honest. However, when gas prices do rise the E85 doesn't rise nearly as much. The spread can increase to make it worth the loss of efficiency.
But listen, I'm not all about it nor do I like it. But it has it's place. And trust me the E85 is not worry, look into the feds passing the laws for E15.
Oh and it should be noted that some of the tuners are setting up their cars to run on E85. I know a local guy that did that to his big power Subby, so he can get a consistently higher Octane.
Mark one up for the lobbyists again. And of course they rubbed it in our face my granting the ethanol lobbyists a waiver on Friday the 13th (of all days). But for now it looks like it would only be for cars that are 2007 and newer (for now).
It would be nice that our Gov't would work for the consumer and not the corporations.
Last edited by RedwoodPerch; 11-08-2010 at 09:17 PM.