Warranty coverage question?
12-16-2011, 05:41 PM
#1
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: 04-25-2010
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Posts: 31
Warranty coverage question?
I just had my HHR in to get the tranny fluid and filter changed and the owner of the shop noticed a couple of issues with it.
He informed me that that one of the axle seals was developing a leak and that the EPC on the transmission was making a buzzing noise when he had it up on the rack. You cannot hear it when the car is on the ground.
I trust this guy completely with all of my transmission work. He is a long time friend of my families, and his shop does nothing but transmission work, so that is his area of expertise.
Does anyone know if either of these items are covered under the 5 year \ 100k mile drivetrain warranty? My car is 4 years old and has 67k miles on it so the 3 year \ 36k mile warranty is long gone. I know I still have a few months of the 5 year warranty left so that would be great if they are covered, as technically they are part of the drive train.
Any advise is always appreciated. Thanks
He informed me that that one of the axle seals was developing a leak and that the EPC on the transmission was making a buzzing noise when he had it up on the rack. You cannot hear it when the car is on the ground.
I trust this guy completely with all of my transmission work. He is a long time friend of my families, and his shop does nothing but transmission work, so that is his area of expertise.
Does anyone know if either of these items are covered under the 5 year \ 100k mile drivetrain warranty? My car is 4 years old and has 67k miles on it so the 3 year \ 36k mile warranty is long gone. I know I still have a few months of the 5 year warranty left so that would be great if they are covered, as technically they are part of the drive train.
Any advise is always appreciated. Thanks
12-16-2011, 06:27 PM
#4
Technical Moderator
Join Date: 01-23-2009
Location: Fredericksburg, Virginia
Posts: 24,671
What is an EPC? What is an axle seal? on an HHR???
By axle seal, does he mean hub bearing? I don't know what an EPC is. Why did you have the trans fluid changed at 67K? If you use it "normally" no service is indicated EVER, under "severe service" it's over 100K (don't remember specifics). You say you trust the guy who services a trans that needs no service? OK, so put the car up on a lift and inspect everything for leaks that's a good idea. You do have an Owner's Manual, right? Service intervals are in there! You can find the manual right here on this forum if you need it. Don't waste money on "old" technology, when you own "new" technology.
The "old" way of doing mechanical services is based on that really bad junk that car companies were giving us in the 60's-90's. The engineering and EPA requirements have changed a lot since then! When GM says change your oil every 12K instead of every 3K, it is because they are TRYING TO SAVE YOU MONEY through engineering not to KILL you.
I cannot understand why we won't just save the money/planet, and I am an old school guy!
End of rant.
By axle seal, does he mean hub bearing? I don't know what an EPC is. Why did you have the trans fluid changed at 67K? If you use it "normally" no service is indicated EVER, under "severe service" it's over 100K (don't remember specifics). You say you trust the guy who services a trans that needs no service? OK, so put the car up on a lift and inspect everything for leaks that's a good idea. You do have an Owner's Manual, right? Service intervals are in there! You can find the manual right here on this forum if you need it. Don't waste money on "old" technology, when you own "new" technology.
The "old" way of doing mechanical services is based on that really bad junk that car companies were giving us in the 60's-90's. The engineering and EPA requirements have changed a lot since then! When GM says change your oil every 12K instead of every 3K, it is because they are TRYING TO SAVE YOU MONEY through engineering not to KILL you.
I cannot understand why we won't just save the money/planet, and I am an old school guy!
End of rant.
12-16-2011, 06:39 PM
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: 03-06-2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 6,869
Severe usage is every 50K for transmission fluid change according to my manual. (2007 auto trans 2LT) That's 50K, 100K, 150K.
Being in Pittsburgh he sees a lot of "hilly terrain"
From the manual...
(h) Change automatic transaxle fluid and filter if
the vehicle is mainly driven under one or more of
these conditions:
− In heavy city traffic where the outside
temperature regularly reaches 90°F (32°C) or
higher.
− In hilly or mountainous terrain.
− When doing frequent trailer towing.
− Uses such as found in taxi, police, or delivery
service.
If you do not use your vehicle under any of these
conditions, the fluid and filter do not require
changing.
Being in Pittsburgh he sees a lot of "hilly terrain"
From the manual...
(h) Change automatic transaxle fluid and filter if
the vehicle is mainly driven under one or more of
these conditions:
− In heavy city traffic where the outside
temperature regularly reaches 90°F (32°C) or
higher.
− In hilly or mountainous terrain.
− When doing frequent trailer towing.
− Uses such as found in taxi, police, or delivery
service.
If you do not use your vehicle under any of these
conditions, the fluid and filter do not require
changing.
12-16-2011, 07:59 PM
#6
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: 04-25-2010
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Posts: 31
The EPC is the electronic pressure control solenoid and it maintains fluid pressure in the trans itself.
I am not sure where the leak is on the axle seal, I have not had a chance to look at it myself. If he says it is leaking, I believe it.
I change my oil when the indicator says i have less than 10% left and I am well acquainted with RTFM. I do 90% of my own maintenance but the trans is the most expensive part on the car, and I need it to last at least 200k miles. $100 for a fluid and filter change is a lot cheaper than rebuilding \ replacing the trans. I grew up turning wrenches in my fathers shop over the last 25 years.
All fluids break down over time, and if you follow the manual you will never change the trans fluid in your car. That just sounds like a recipe for failure to me. I feel at 70k miles it is about time. The Pittsburgh area is very hilly and sees dramatic temp swings (over 60F yesterday 29F tonight). I also average over 500 miles a week on this car so I am not taking any chances. It is my work car and I do a lot of driving to make a living. So while it is not severe duty, it is well above average.
Thank you Greybeard. Your logic is correct and I appreciate you pointing out the obvious.
I am not sure where the leak is on the axle seal, I have not had a chance to look at it myself. If he says it is leaking, I believe it.
I change my oil when the indicator says i have less than 10% left and I am well acquainted with RTFM. I do 90% of my own maintenance but the trans is the most expensive part on the car, and I need it to last at least 200k miles. $100 for a fluid and filter change is a lot cheaper than rebuilding \ replacing the trans. I grew up turning wrenches in my fathers shop over the last 25 years.
All fluids break down over time, and if you follow the manual you will never change the trans fluid in your car. That just sounds like a recipe for failure to me. I feel at 70k miles it is about time. The Pittsburgh area is very hilly and sees dramatic temp swings (over 60F yesterday 29F tonight). I also average over 500 miles a week on this car so I am not taking any chances. It is my work car and I do a lot of driving to make a living. So while it is not severe duty, it is well above average.
Thank you Greybeard. Your logic is correct and I appreciate you pointing out the obvious.
12-16-2011, 08:04 PM
#7
Technical Moderator
Join Date: 01-23-2009
Location: Fredericksburg, Virginia
Posts: 24,671
Severe usage is every 50K for transmission fluid change according to my manual. (2007 auto trans 2LT) That's 50K, 100K, 150K.
Being in Pittsburgh he sees a lot of "hilly terrain"
From the manual...
(h) Change automatic transaxle fluid and filter if
the vehicle is mainly driven under one or more of
these conditions:
− In heavy city traffic where the outside
temperature regularly reaches 90°F (32°C) or
higher.
− In hilly or mountainous terrain.
− When doing frequent trailer towing.
− Uses such as found in taxi, police, or delivery
service.
If you do not use your vehicle under any of these
conditions, the fluid and filter do not require
changing.
Being in Pittsburgh he sees a lot of "hilly terrain"
From the manual...
(h) Change automatic transaxle fluid and filter if
the vehicle is mainly driven under one or more of
these conditions:
− In heavy city traffic where the outside
temperature regularly reaches 90°F (32°C) or
higher.
− In hilly or mountainous terrain.
− When doing frequent trailer towing.
− Uses such as found in taxi, police, or delivery
service.
If you do not use your vehicle under any of these
conditions, the fluid and filter do not require
changing.
.When you start into 500 miles a DAY like I do, for a living, we can start talking severe service. 2008 LT auto 218,000 miles, no trans service needed yet. I regularly drive 2K a week in Washington, DC traffic and several long haul drives about 600-800 miles a month. My HHR is what pays for my home, I do what is "needed" to keep it going, but I cannot afford to waste money on senseless "old time mechanicking"! And I am an "old timer" I remember when 100,000 miles on a car deserved a medal, do you remember the 100K radiator medals?.
At 67K I would not be surprised if you need a new wheel hub, I just do not recognize the stated symptom, they don't begin to leak they fail. I have never experienced a mechanic of any specialty diagnosing a particular internal component of a trans, they normally say something like "it's broken" since it means the same thing: needs to be rebuilt, since once it's opened up, you have to go all the way. I thought that the original question was basically "should I worry about what the trans guy said"? If you ask that question on an internet forum, I would think that you would be expecting people to ask "why".
I really did not mean to kindle a fire, I just don't like to hear about people spending their money on their car instead of their home/kids/food. Modern cars are made better, engineered better and made of better materials than the cars any of us were brought up caring for, and so they need a lot less care than "your dad's Olds", in my case "my dad's Imperial".
Flame OUT!
Never mind!
Spend your money, the Obama wants you to support your trans guy, and go broke doing it. Re distribute you wealth! You obviously are better off than the "worker". OOPS! I did it again. End of Rant.
Last edited by donbrew; 12-16-2011 at 08:51 PM.
12-16-2011, 08:22 PM
#8
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: 04-25-2010
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Posts: 31
Like I said... 4 years 67K, that is not heavy use even in the hills & hollows! I did not see any mention in the OP of commercial use, like "all the time, every day". But, a very literal translation would be: "if you don't drive ALL of the time on the prairie then change the ATF & filter every 50K" . Notice; no mention of flushing..
.Personal opinions and rants help no one, especially when you know nothing about the person making the post or their reason for the post.
