Zzp lnf s256et kit on its way
 

Well i havnt been on here in a minute but i recently had several throttle body, throttle pedal failures followed by our beloved stock turbo destroying itself so i said enough is enough i just claimed my army enlistment bonus after three years so today i ordered the s256et stage 3 kit and im thinking about the stage 1 cams and nuetral balance shafts as well i already have the stage 4 clutch installed so i have no worrys but zzp told me theres a few hhr's running this kit and it directly bolts on so i will keep you guys updated about the successes and potential failures of this kit

Cool can't wait to hear how this turns out. Finally there are a few HHRs doing turbo upgrades. This will help me choose when I get around to shelling out for a bigger turbo:lol: Good Luck!

what is "direct bolt on" mean though?? lol...hahn is the only "true" direct bolt on. anytime you need different manifolds and fabrication,it's not a "bolt on". heard it's a nice kit though.

I was confused by the true-bolt-on description on the Hahn site. It says you don't need to change anything, then later it says you need external BOV instead of internal BOV as well as a new tune. So I guess you don't need to change anything....except you do.

I think he means the kit well fit since its made mainly for a cobalt.

Ya and out here in the fort sill area we have one guy with a cobalt with the massive "bat mo wheel" bullseye turbo and its beastly plus ive heard nothing but positives from zzp so thats who ill invest in but the estimated whp on the canned tune with the kit alone is 420whp im hoping to catch a good 450whp and i will also be testing the n2mb wot box 2 step launch on the ss and see how well those hoosier grab on a launch lets just pray to dear lord baby jesus i dont snap an axle.... Long live experimentation right??

before you launch if you don't have them already get some rotated mounts or you WILL snap an axle. be easy on it too or your trans will not like you;)

For daily driving 400 seems more than enough, even for the track. 450 just seems like trouble, on stock internals and the tranny. You can tell when your tires don't work, but I don't know anybody who can tell when the internals are bout to go. To me a bigger turbo making clean dependable power is better than trying to push the limits. Either way it's more power, just safer detuned a bit.

I totally agree with foolmoon.
Anything over 400 H.P. thats generating a lot of torque, is asking for some possible grief for a daily driver. First for a DD, to have to have a tire that can handle the power, otherwise you turn your ride into a pooch, with no traction.
The FWD cars that are turning the big numbers[12 sec. and lower] have lots of other parts that are beefed up to handle that much torque, and most are trailered to the track[thats why you see the front tow strap hook on the front-they are even towed to the starting line], and rarely, if ever driven on the street,
450 H.P., you can bet they have internal engine parts that are beefed up, and also major HD clutches, beefed trans, and axles, if they run slicks with that kind of power.
H.P. alone does not equate to being either fast or quick. You have to have the complete package, engine, drivetrain, and decent driver skill, to make it work. anything less and you are a also ran-Read: POOCH].
Daily driver, with out major mods, and pushing 450 H.P. better make good friends with their local tow truck company. It's a long walk home, and really puts the hurt on the wallet. "Moon"

Theres a lot more supporting mods i will be doing including the trans mounts, engine mounts, traction bars, manual boost controller to turn it down to 15psi for daily, etc.. Im still compiling a big list of parts to support street/strip use and the large gobs of torque ill be making just usually dont have time to post it all on here while im working in the motorpool

All the parts you listed. Mounts, etc. add stress to the tranny! Have fun with a boost controller, those are for cars without computers. Won't work for us.

This made me laugh
Gotta love when people try claim knowledge and get shot down

I wasn't trying to shoot him down, just keeping him from spending money thats not needed. I think one of the last compatible boost controller cars was the mid 90's supra

Since a few of us have been on here for years, we can help with some power questions. Especially since some questions just keep getting asked, over and over again.

This past weekend my buddy Jason snapped an axle on his 'balt. Found out yesterday, that he welded the motor mount solid and filled it in with roofing butyl. He was able to stop engine movement, but the added stress transferred to his driveshaft, and snap.

Catch cans are another example. I had one for about a year, when we we're all freaking out about fouling the maf. It was bone dry, so I took it off. Some people still run a catch can, but its not an issue and doesn't come up much on the forum.

If your worried about DD, get a selectable tune. But honestly, its all in the foot control.

Then why would zzp offer a pcm tune with either selectable or a manual boost controller its specifically said in the drop down option menu and i called zzp awhile back and asked them about it too

It is better to run a mbc in a big turbo setup. It helps keep the boost steady where the ecm control wont do so. Rotated mounts are absolutely necesary on s 5spd and aid keeping things intact not cause things to break

Thats why i trusted zzp with it and moon i dont take offense to anything anyone says im 21 and im here to gain knowledge and also do product reviews i love my hhr and the "attention" it brings on and off base but question if yall know is there any good tuners in the oklahoma/texas area id go to james hes amazing and has helped me before but kentucky is a little far:lol:

guys look at zzp's site. their mbc is a tune with a hi and low setting mapped to a knob, its a tune. A true mbc, is a valve that leaks pressure, and works much like a volume knob, with alot more than just 2 settings. I had one on my '87 300zx, it was mounted in the dash, and you could hear it sucking. turned all the way up, closed it off. a two position knob... is a switch, and everything can be done through tuning, even with turbo's that are in the 60,70,80,90 mm range. there are a few members running bigger turbos, and not one has a mbc, Atl your going bigger, adding a mbc? right now HAHN is installing a S20g on an hhr and no mention of mbc, HHRsouth went bigger turbo, no MBC. Rob is throwing parts like crazy no mbc there either. its just not needed in its current form of a two position switch. and the old style, will completely give your ecm a WTF moment, especially since we have computer controlled variable timing.

Also, your BOV doubles somewhat as a mbc, as you can adjust the valve and spring rate. your better off just adding a valve to a vac line, but again it will f'up the ecm, and make it think its losing vac.

our LNF kit, (and LSJ turbo kit, and 2.2/2.4 kit, and our grand prix 3800 kits,and LSx truck turbo kits....) ALL come with a manual boost controller.....i have no idea why you would think that they wont work on a computer controlled car???? that is just false information. they work VERY well.....

and to the O.P. good to see another HHR guy with the turbo upgrade kit! i've sold a few of them to HHR guys already :) i would stay around 375-400 on a daily driver car....and please, dont NLS into 3rd all the time, it WILL break!

not to be a jerk, but Ryan drives his 9 sec cobalt to and from work allllll the time, our 10 sec LNF cobalt gets street driven for weeks on end, and driven to the track, we drive our 11 second auto cobalt to the track, and rent it out to customers to drive while we work on their stuff all the time. we use the manual boost controller to turn it down to a reasonable power level.

the front tow hook strap is on the car because many road coarses REQUIRE the car to have a tow hook on it just in case you break down out in the middle of the track a mile from the parking lot.

taken from our website:

Option 3: This determines the boost control of the kit, 375-400whp tune is a ZZP pcm with a manual boost controller, that turns the boost up or down with a knob and is (usually) mounted under the hood. This option requires you to either send in your PCM core first(preferred) or pay the refundable core charge. it does not have only 2 settings...it is a regular twist knob.....the trifecta based selectable tune is the one that is like a "on-off switch"

Steve............ THANK YOU FOR REPLYING.

saves me a lot of time replying. i'm seriously sitting at my desk shaking my head.

:lol:

Your site says its a 2 position switch hi and low, and requires ecm tuning to work. in my experience a mbc is a valve, not a switch and shouldn't require anything but tapping a vac line, so please clarify how that is not a tune mapped to a 2 position knob?

Option 3: This determines the boost control of the kit, 375-400whp tune is a ZZP pcm with a manual boost controller, that turns the boost up or down with a knob and is (usually) mounted under the hood. This option requires you to either send in your PCM core first(preferred) or pay the refundable core charge.



The selectable boost control option uses boost controls that uses the factory Traction control button that can change the boost in turn changing the power of the car. The low setting will be 18-19psi and the high boost setting will be 24-25psi.


^this is a completely separate option. the hi-lo boost switch is something WAY different than our MBC. as long as your over/under boost tables are adjusted broad enough, you will not run in to issues.

(just an FYI, i do not sell the MBC seperately on my site, you wont find a product description page for it, it's only included with kits...maybe that is where the confusion is coming from)



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I was'nt trying tp "burst anyones bubble" just saying that around 400 H.P. for a car driven on the street daily, is about the limit for the tire you can put under one, and getting decent traction. Track use and slicks are a different ball game.
ZZP: are you running stock trans on you 9 and 10 sec. Balts? Enlighten me of this. "Moon"

totally agree with you that 400+ is useless on the street with normal tires in a FWD car....still driveable, just not going to hook up anywhere :)

the 9 sec cobalt now has an auto trans so no..
the 10 sec LNF has a 4.45 gear trans in it and is living on a prayer right now like the rest of the high HP guys....

I'm more curious details on automatic trans being used



MBC seems like bad idea in my book unless the tables are adjusted enough be safely used?? I can just see someone buying this kit and turning knob with no knowledge and then blaming zzp for bad kit..... Steve I'm sure you know where I'm going with this input....

I know most turbo kits avoid mbc for this reason

the trans is a 4t65E (Grand Prix GTP transmission) with custom adapter plates, and lots of internal goodies (same trans that is in our mid 8 second grand prix) it is indestructable :)

when you lower the boost on the MBC, the maf makes up for the difference pretty well, and adjust the fuel accordingly.

we dont sell the MBC as a kit, it only comes with our turbo kits, which come with a tune...you can set max boost in the PCM so it closes the throttle (to prevent people from cranking it up to the stars and scattering engines on the pavement)

Ok that makes sense!

Steve ill email you on the 4t65e

i didnt see the s256 on the hhr when i search hhr >_<

ZZSteve: thanks for the info on the trans. I'm auto so I was real curious about a stock auto taking that kind of torque.
Just for chuckles, what would be the tab, on a set up auto from you, for my HHR-SS. "Moon"

Thank you zzsteve for clarifying it very detailed explanation thats why i trust you and your products and im as giddy as a schoolgirl over this upgrade

ditto here

http://shop.zzperformance.com/store/...nsmission.aspx


i will have to check if we have an upgraded input shaft available at this time for the 4t45....we have built a few of these for turbo 2.4 guys, and they seem to hold up pretty well :)

Steve compared to stock what can zzp 45 do over stock? Better power load I get anything else?
And how about the 65. What's involved to use it?

Welp all parts are on the way 6500 bucks later..... Totally worth it and i will be playing with the snow performance stage 2 water/meth injection

Holy Cow! What all did you order for $6,500? Christ you can buy a crate motor for that, and still have some money left over.

no their short block comes in at about 5500 shipped.

I'll be watching this build with intrest. Just how much power he has,whether he can hook it up, and if it won't eat itself up. Hope it not just a daily driver, LOL. "Moon"

Take alot of pics!!!

Ok so delay on parts zzp is custom fabbing their hhr ss intake to fit the s256 turbo, waiting in parts aeroforce gauge is already mounted up

dont get the nbs, just delete it.