AM/PM gas stations all the waaaay

 

The idea of bio-fuel is a good one, although using government subsidized (read: our tax dollars) corn is not the answer. Brazil is able to produce profitable ethanol from sugar. There are many other ways of producing biofuel that can actually work (read: profitable). Corn is arguably the worst resource to use for fuel; it is very inefficient to produce (input vs. output): it uses huge amounts of water per gallon of fuel, it uses farmland that previously was used to grow food for humans and animals, it requires diesel fuel to plant, cultivate and harvest, it yields a limited quantity of alcohol for resources used to produce it. Whether we eat the corn or not, its use as a motor fuel impacts the food supply of the world. The government, thankfully, has backed off its mandate to require corn alcohol to be used as a percentage of our motor fuel.

 

The whole industry is still growing, despite the fact that ethanol has been around for 100 years. The discovery of oil is what crushed it's development. I'm all for ethanol, but you are right, the current situation only makes it a minor alternative at the moment. Once the industry matures and perfects/simplifies the production process, it will be better.

 

I couldn't agree more. Done right, it could be WONDERFULL !!
Produced the way it is currently in American is disastrous.

 

I run e85 most of the time because of the extra power. I've been wondering about the low mpg as I'm currently around 20 mpgs in mixed driving but mostly suburbs.

The last tank is 87 octane and I've seen a bit of an increase in mpg. I don't drive my car that much but I'm glad this thread was made so I understand why my mpg numbers are so much lower than others.

On the political side, everything in America seems to be executed in an inefficient way, ethanol is just another example. It's too bad our politicians are are more concerned with being politicians than actually running the country.

 

The E85 on the local pump here in Florida says it is 104 octane! I have a friend who runs alcohal in his rail dragster. Premium fuel has higher octane and lower BTUs, including regular leaded gasoline of old.

 

over the last 151,000 miles my HHr 2LT has averaged 28.7 mpg, I carry a lot of golf samples that do not weigh a lot but they weigh something. E85 is a joke cause the energy produced is less than the energy used to produce it. The end product does not have the same energy as its competition which is gasoline. I do not know what the answer is but is not E85. I am amazed at those saying they get extra power, I am at a loss with that since the figures are it has less energy which is the lower mpg #.

 

You can make 5% more hp with e85. When using it with forced induction much higher numbers can be achieved. The higher octane allows more timing, it burns more efficiently at stoich and runs cooler.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by panelmoxie

...E85 is a joke cause the energy produced is less than the energy used to produce it.

It is true that ethanol takes more power to produce it than it returns, so as a 'Green' solution it is anything but.

However it can produce more power because it has a higher octane rating than regular pump gas. High octane pump gas (read 93 octane) has lower BTUs than regular 87 octane gasoline, but is capable producing more power in a properly tuned motor because it allows more advanced timing than lower octane.

BTUs do not always correlate with MPG as it does with E85. In my turbo motor the fuel mileage is a little better with lower BTU 93 octane that it is with higher BTU 87 octane fuel.

 

Good points. The problem is too that ethanol can actually be as efficient or more than diesel if it is run in an engine designed to burn ethanol exclusively. It would allow for a higher compression ratio and have good mileage. Of course it's production numbers do not allow for all that. It would need to be as readily available as diesel fuel is.