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Wondering if anyone has any tips and tricks to share for using adjustable camber bolts on the front struts? And apologies ahead of time for the long ramble.
Here's where I'm at: I have an 07 2LT with just over 180k miles on it. Never had an accident and for the age and mileage the car is in very decent shape. It has met it's share of potholes, though, and as a result my alignment has been badly knocked around. Add to that the bushings here and there have just worn out with old age. I have been slowly replacing the front suspension components: So far I've replaced on both sides the Lower control arms, strut assembly's, outer tie rod ends, and sway bar links. Everything seems rock solid now (with the exception of a new (and defective) LCA ball joint that will be replaced soon). I also bought new sway bar bushings, but upon inspection my current bushings seem okay, so I'm going to hold on to those for a while longer.
Now, the purpose of this post - my camber SUCKS! I was hoping/praying that by replacing all the aforementioned parts that my camber would correct its self. It did a little, but not enough. Currently my front driver side sits at -3.25 and my passenger side is sitting at close to -4. This is causing premature inner tire wear. I did try to install adjustable camber bolts in the top strut hole of the steering knuckle. That gave me about a 1 to 1.25 degree adjustment, which is better than nothing, but not close enough to get me to spec, which I believe is suggested to be at -0.95.
My toe is spot on with 1/16 inch inner toe on both front wheels.
I've been researching in the usual places and found suggestions to install adjustable camber bolts in both the top AND bottom strut holes, offsetting them in opposite directions so that you can achieve more range. In theory this would give me a range of +/- 3 degrees which will be more than enough to get me to spec. Has anyone here tried this? Any advice to share? Do's or don'ts? Any specific camber kits you can suggest? Also a side note, I will be taking it to an alignment shop as soon as my LCA ball joint is replaced but I wanted to see if I can get the camber as close as possible myself beforehand. Thanks!
The camber should still be in specs - if it isn't, I'd suspect that there is some hidden damage, or some of the components you replaced are wrong. 3.5 and 4.0 degrees is a whole lot out of spec. Have you installed a lowering kit or such?
No, up until I started replacing the worn out suspension parts mentioned before, I've never done anything more than change the oil and rotate the tires. Everything on the car (pre parts replacement) is factory. The obvious negative camber and inner tire wear is what drew my attention down this path to begin with. Before I ever touch the car, the camber was way negative. What caused it? Who knows. There are lots of uneven roads and potholes around where I live so continued prolonged abuse is probably the culprit, but I can't be sure. My first repair was the LCA's which my mechanic told me had blown out bushings. Cool, I thought, that must be why my camber is so bad, right? Replaced them. Although it solved some other issues, it still didn't fix the camber. Next I thought maybe my struts were bent. Replaced those. Smoother ride but still didn't fix the problem. Followed that up by replacing the sway bar links and tie rod ends (which needed replacing anyway). Fixed the camber a bit, but not a lot. And of course I always make sure my vehicle is absolutely level when checking the camber using a magnetic camber tool.
I have not inspected the hub assembly, the sway bar (other than the bushings), or the axle for any damage. In fact I'm not sure what I would even be looking for if I tried. I'm trying to do as much diagnosis and repair work myself as I possibly can to save money but also to work on it with my son so he can learn some of this right along with me. When I did take the car in for an alignment yesterday, the guy told me I would have to replace a bad ball join in the passenger side LCA first. I asked him about the camber and he said he would just install adjustable camber bolts, which I've tried myself, but like I said, it didn't bring it close enough to spec. It's the install of both top and bottom bolts that I want to attempt next. Just wondering if anyone has had any successes or failures with this method before I waste time and money.
FYWW
It looks like you understand front end geometry. Like Whopper said there is an underlying cause for your excessive camber numbers. Something has to be bent. The camber bolts are a band-aid. What about your caster ? Is it affected ? I guessing you owned it from new. If the lower control arm have new bushings and ball joints that camber should pull into spec.
Potholes and ruts are not going to wear just the inside of the tire. Is it on both tires you see inner wear ?
Did the person that checked your alignment bring the back to the front ? Always have to have good known tread tires to do alignment. I say this because I've done many working in repair shops.
Toe in or out will not affect a camber angle. Why? Because it is the last thing to check and adjust when doing an alignment.
Something is bent or not bolted up to specs, it may even be incorrect struts, I’ve seen cheap struts and the brackets aren’t even near where they should be on the strut body
are the ball joints mounted on the correct topside of the LCA? I’ve seen those mixed up too, installed by professionals , just incorrectly.
I put lowering springs on mine(1.7 inch drop ) and it barely changed the camber. It was still inside of specs so I didn't even install the 1.25 camber bolts that I had purchased.
Just curious. You say you replaced both of the lower control arms ? It wasn't by chance the cheap steel arms that some places sell and say they'll fit the HHR ?
If so , you should replace those with the aluminum ones that it came with when new.
The last set of LCAs I put on made for a noticeable camber change! I could actually see the wheels hanging at an angle. The 1.5 degree adjustment from the offset bolts did the job. Those ball joints only lasted 3.000 miles.
They seemed to be the same measurements, I am guessing that the pattern in China got changed somehow.
Maybe they have consolidated part numbers without regard to reality. A body pull may be the only correction for that large a difference.
I submit that changing the camber does indeed change the toe and vice versa, they both need rechecking after changes are made. Because of the 3D nature of caster. If the caster was 0 they would not bear on each other. Not taking into account the curve of the knuckle lever.
Lowering springs (sagging springs) have a large affect on everything as do different tires and wheels than factory.
If you look at before and after data you will note that the camber usually changes when only the toe can be changed on purpose.
@Cat Man HHR I forgot to mention that I had just installed brand new tires just hours prior to taking it to the alignment shop. But yes, to answer your question, both front tires would wear out on the insides down to the exposed metal shreds. The driver side would wear only slightly more significantly than the passenger. As for Castor? I haven't looked into it but there's nothing visibly off about it. I don't have adjustable castor on my struts so not sure what I could do there. I'll have to ask the alignment guy once I get this ball joint replaced.
@Oldblue I suppose it's possible the strut assemblies I installed are just not top quality? Again I'll know more once I take it in. I'm hoping to avoid having to buy parts unless absolutely necessary, but if that's what it takes then so be it. And yeah, the ball joints on the LCA's are positioned and secured correctly. I've gone over every bolt and nut in my suspension with a torque wrench to make sure everything was tightened down to spec.
@firemangeorge Yeah, the LCA's I bought are cheap alright. Detroit Axle's. I installed them about two months ago and already the ball joint on the passenger side has blown out. I'm replacing them with aluminum Moog's that someone else here had suggested. You get what you pay for. This was my first foray into DIY vehicle repairs so it was inevitable that I would make some mistakes. Live and learn, right? Thankfully there are resources like this forum for me to sap knowledge from.
@donbrew Since the alignment guy had turned me away until I replace the worn ball joint on the LCA, I had to temporarily resort to checking and adjusting the toe myself using the string method. I know it's not a perm fix, but for now it's all I can do. The toe was off quite a bit prior to my adjustments (including a crooked steering wheel) and I could clearly feel a difference in the ride once I put them back into spec. Much smoother. Straight steering wheel, too. Hoping to have the new control arms installed next week and then back to the alignment shop it goes. With the new arms installed I will check the camber once again to see if it made any difference. Fingers crossed!
Detroit Axle!!!!!! Those are stamped steel, not the aluminum ones. Ie: https://www.detroitaxle.com/shop/sus...nt-assembly-9/
It's interesting too that they also say their stamped ones fit the SS models - and FE1 suspensions only - so wrong on several points.
FMG - gonna order a set for your SS?
One would think that if they are replacing parts, that if the parts didn't look identical, or at least looked cheaper than the originals, that they would check to see if they were the actual recommended replacement. ........... (Yeah a lower control arm for $44??).
I got a pair of DNA Motoring strut assemblies from Amazon. I know I know, I tried to get away with the cheap and easy route only to find myself spending more $ than if I had just gotten the right parts from the start. Lesson learned. It had decent reviews, but I take Amazon reviews with a grain of salt. They do ride well, I'll give them that. But if the part that attaches to the knuckle is off a bit from where it should be, I can see how that would throw off the camber. Makes sense. Glad I found this forum. Only wish I would have found it before I opened up my wallet.
02-22-2019, 03:07 PM
