Brake judder again
11-23-2016, 06:33 PM
#1
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Join Date: 07-20-2016
Location: LA, CA
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Brake judder again
I just replaced my rotors about several K miles ago because of brake judder. The issue was fixed untill now. Vibrations are back again. The rear brakes are adjusted correctly, and the rotors were high quality ones from ACDelco.
I've read several people have posted that they had to replace their warped rotors a few times. What is causing this, and is there a fix for it?
Thanks
I've read several people have posted that they had to replace their warped rotors a few times. What is causing this, and is there a fix for it?
Thanks
11-24-2016, 05:59 AM
#3
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rotors replace must be associated with replacement pads - I hope you did it.
as far as I can tell, calipers incorrect operation - the cause of the curves rotors. Dismantling calipers, diagnosis, repair or replacement - without waiting for the curvature of the new rotors.
as far as I can tell, calipers incorrect operation - the cause of the curves rotors. Dismantling calipers, diagnosis, repair or replacement - without waiting for the curvature of the new rotors.
11-24-2016, 08:32 AM
#4
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11-24-2016, 04:54 PM
#5
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I am pretty sure that the problem is improper brake in procedure after installing new pads and rotors. The first time I experienced this problem is after replacing front brake pads without doing anything to the rotors. The pads were not broken in at all and brake judder at highway speed started to appear after some time.
Back then someone mentioned that the rotors were warped. Well, silly me got a set of new rotors and new brake pads, and threw away almost new brake pads and old rotors. After installing everything I again didn't do brake in procedure and began to experience brake grinding noise a shot time after. Now I am dealing with grinding noise and brake judder.
"Anytime you replace brake pads the rotors need to be resurfaced or replaced. There is a glaze burnt into the metal from all the braking done with the old pads. This causes noise and brake fade because the glaze keeps the heat from dissipating properly. I've also had my share of problems with Wagner ceramic pads. They are soft and I've had pad material transfer to rotors causing a low grumbling noise and brake shudder. I stick with Wearever rotors and Platinum brake pads that come with new hardware. They are available at Advance Auto." (https://answers.yahoo.com/question/i...0064258AAZISh4)
I will turn the rotors tomorrow, sand brake pads, lube everything, and set the pad surface.
"2. Yes, new pads can do this, especially ceramic pads. What I do is "set the pads". After installing new pads you need to take the car upto 20-30 mph on and do a few very hard stops. This will set the pad surface. It causes the pad form to the rotor and conditions the pads surface." (https://answers.yahoo.com/question/i...0064258AAZISh4)
"PREVENTION
There is only one way to prevent this sort of thing - following proper break in procedures for both pad and disc and use the correct pad for your driving style and conditions. All high performance after market discs and pads should come with both installation and break in instructions. The procedures are very similar between manufacturers. With respect to the pads, the bonding resins must be burned off relatively slowly to avoid both fade and uneven deposits. The procedure is several stops of increasing severity with a brief cooling period between them. After the last stop, the system should be allowed to cool to ambient temperature. Typically, a series of ten increasingly hard stops from 60mph to 5 mph with normal acceleration in between should get the job done for a high performance street pad. During pad or disc break-in, do not come to a complete stop, so plan where and when you do this procedure with care and concern for yourself and the safety of others. If you come to a complete stop before the break-in process is completed there is the chance for non-uniform pad material transfer or pad imprinting to take place and the results will be what the whole process is trying to avoid. Game over." (-Warped- Brake Disc and Other Myths)
Back then someone mentioned that the rotors were warped. Well, silly me got a set of new rotors and new brake pads, and threw away almost new brake pads and old rotors. After installing everything I again didn't do brake in procedure and began to experience brake grinding noise a shot time after. Now I am dealing with grinding noise and brake judder.
"Anytime you replace brake pads the rotors need to be resurfaced or replaced. There is a glaze burnt into the metal from all the braking done with the old pads. This causes noise and brake fade because the glaze keeps the heat from dissipating properly. I've also had my share of problems with Wagner ceramic pads. They are soft and I've had pad material transfer to rotors causing a low grumbling noise and brake shudder. I stick with Wearever rotors and Platinum brake pads that come with new hardware. They are available at Advance Auto." (https://answers.yahoo.com/question/i...0064258AAZISh4)
I will turn the rotors tomorrow, sand brake pads, lube everything, and set the pad surface.
"2. Yes, new pads can do this, especially ceramic pads. What I do is "set the pads". After installing new pads you need to take the car upto 20-30 mph on and do a few very hard stops. This will set the pad surface. It causes the pad form to the rotor and conditions the pads surface." (https://answers.yahoo.com/question/i...0064258AAZISh4)
"PREVENTION
There is only one way to prevent this sort of thing - following proper break in procedures for both pad and disc and use the correct pad for your driving style and conditions. All high performance after market discs and pads should come with both installation and break in instructions. The procedures are very similar between manufacturers. With respect to the pads, the bonding resins must be burned off relatively slowly to avoid both fade and uneven deposits. The procedure is several stops of increasing severity with a brief cooling period between them. After the last stop, the system should be allowed to cool to ambient temperature. Typically, a series of ten increasingly hard stops from 60mph to 5 mph with normal acceleration in between should get the job done for a high performance street pad. During pad or disc break-in, do not come to a complete stop, so plan where and when you do this procedure with care and concern for yourself and the safety of others. If you come to a complete stop before the break-in process is completed there is the chance for non-uniform pad material transfer or pad imprinting to take place and the results will be what the whole process is trying to avoid. Game over." (-Warped- Brake Disc and Other Myths)
11-25-2016, 01:31 AM
#6
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If you didn't check the other suspension bits as suggested by Donbrew, you may just be throwing more money away. The big bushing at the end of the Lower control arms, the ball joints, hubs etc., all need to be checked before you start replacing brake parts.
Interesting info from the web - makes me wonder how I am still alive after replacing pads without machining the old rotors, without following the break-in procedure etc, etc..
Interesting info from the web - makes me wonder how I am still alive after replacing pads without machining the old rotors, without following the break-in procedure etc, etc..
11-25-2016, 03:13 PM
#7
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Join Date: 07-20-2016
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I would have never thought it is the case, but it seems like my brake pads are worn down almost to bare metal! I just replaced those 6,5K miles ago with ACDelco 14D1160CH Advantage Ceramic Front Disc Brake Pad Set.
No wounder my brake fluid was going down so quickly that I was even thinking there was a leak into the brake booster. Usually a set of pads would last me very long time, but with my current driving it seems that I have to replace pads quite often.
Just dropped off rotors at my local mechanic and he told me that it is pretty normal for Uber drivers to have such a high brake pad usage. Also, AutoZone employee told me, when I was purchasing their Duralast brake pads, that for as long as I have the same car I don't have to pay for pads because they are covered by warranty. Just bring the worn down brake pads back to AutoZone, give them your phone number, and get a new set for free. Got to love that! And if I am not satisfied with the way the old ones wear I can exchange them for a better set and just pay the difference.
Whopper, you mean that you NEVER resurface rotors when changing brake pads, and don't even hit them with 150 sand paper?!
No wounder my brake fluid was going down so quickly that I was even thinking there was a leak into the brake booster. Usually a set of pads would last me very long time, but with my current driving it seems that I have to replace pads quite often.
Just dropped off rotors at my local mechanic and he told me that it is pretty normal for Uber drivers to have such a high brake pad usage. Also, AutoZone employee told me, when I was purchasing their Duralast brake pads, that for as long as I have the same car I don't have to pay for pads because they are covered by warranty. Just bring the worn down brake pads back to AutoZone, give them your phone number, and get a new set for free. Got to love that! And if I am not satisfied with the way the old ones wear I can exchange them for a better set and just pay the difference.
Whopper, you mean that you NEVER resurface rotors when changing brake pads, and don't even hit them with 150 sand paper?!
11-25-2016, 03:29 PM
#8
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Good deal on the Autozone replacements. I've used their warranty before and they stood behind their stuff 100%.
Nope, I've never resurfaced them, nor use sandpaper on them, from Volvos, Toyotas, Mazda's and the HHR. Actually I had one set of rotors resurfaced on the HHR, but it was a waste of time as it was the lower control arm rear bushings that was causing the problem.
But to each their own. :)
Nope, I've never resurfaced them, nor use sandpaper on them, from Volvos, Toyotas, Mazda's and the HHR. Actually I had one set of rotors resurfaced on the HHR, but it was a waste of time as it was the lower control arm rear bushings that was causing the problem.
But to each their own. :)
11-26-2016, 11:32 PM
#9
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Join Date: 07-31-2010
Location: Chattanooga, TN
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I am convinced that the so often experienced brake pulsing issues with this car is simply a matter of undersized brakes. Chevy did after all put the HHR on the cobalt frame from what I understand. The last time I replaced the rotors I used Centrix high carbon rotors with Hawk blue pads, and replaced the caliper mounting brackets so I could use LT rotors on our LS. I broke everything in according to the book. This combination did much better than the Akebono/OEM stuff, but we still have pulsing after about 8k or so. I have never had pulsing issues on any other car/truck I've owned/driven to include Olds, Chevy, BMW, Nissan, Honda, and VW.
11-27-2016, 07:24 AM
#10
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Check wheel hub bearings as well, if they havn't been replaced in 20k milesor so they're cheep and easy to replace. Ive solved wavy rotors before by just cleaning them up with 320 grit sandpaper, mainly removing embedded contamination more so than metal.