A/C Charging issue
08-10-2018, 02:15 AM
#1
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Join Date: 10-04-2015
Location: Whitney Texas
Posts: 41
A/C Charging issue
My 2010 A/C stopped cooling as well as it had been but was still working. So I naturally figured it was a little low on R-134A. I have a set of digital MasterCool gauges. So I checked the pressures and sure enough, the low side was @ 30psi and the high side was @ 140psi. The factory sticker on the radiator indicates a capacity of .9 pounds (14.4ozs) of freon.
I had the vehicle in my shop with a squirrel cage fan blowing on the condenser. The temperature @ the front of the condenser was 85 degrees. So the R-134A charts info indicates for LowSide 45-55psi and HighSide 225-250psi. I not sure what the humidity was but we had been getting scattered showers on and off all morning.
So I start adding freon into the system and the pressures are really slow to come up. I put in 12 ozs of freon and the pressures were L/S 40psi, H/S 170psi. For a system that only holds 14.4ozs, a full can of freon is a lot for a system that was still cooling. I ran about 6 miles to town and back and my center air register temperature was 37 degrees.
I'm, completely satisfied with the way it's cooling. Its just got me stumped why the pressures are still low. I'm really hesitant to add any more freon when the factory sticker says .9 lbs. Does that capacity sound normal for our HHR's?
I welcome any input you'll may have!
I had the vehicle in my shop with a squirrel cage fan blowing on the condenser. The temperature @ the front of the condenser was 85 degrees. So the R-134A charts info indicates for LowSide 45-55psi and HighSide 225-250psi. I not sure what the humidity was but we had been getting scattered showers on and off all morning.
So I start adding freon into the system and the pressures are really slow to come up. I put in 12 ozs of freon and the pressures were L/S 40psi, H/S 170psi. For a system that only holds 14.4ozs, a full can of freon is a lot for a system that was still cooling. I ran about 6 miles to town and back and my center air register temperature was 37 degrees.
I'm, completely satisfied with the way it's cooling. Its just got me stumped why the pressures are still low. I'm really hesitant to add any more freon when the factory sticker says .9 lbs. Does that capacity sound normal for our HHR's?
I welcome any input you'll may have!
08-10-2018, 10:34 AM
#3
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Join Date: 10-04-2015
Location: Whitney Texas
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I haven't physically looked to see if the compressor is spinning but its cooling so I assume it has to be spinning. The fan is running although there's no detectable unusual noise coming from its location or the compressor.
I have a check engine light that comes and goes. My OBD I/II scanner indicates a misfire on cylinder #1 and sometimes on cylinder #2. This started about 2 years ago after I replaced the factory spark plugs at 70K w new Iridium plugs. I've swapped coil packs between Cyl's 1 & 2 with no change. I even swapped coil packs Cyl's #1 & #2 with Cyl's #3 & #4 trying to isolate the issue. But the cylinder # 1 misfire code resets.
I also get a traction control light that started coming on after replacing the front rotors and pads @ 70K w/ new Raybestos ones. That code said the front brakes were out of spec's? I can clear that code and within a couple weeks it will reappear.
When both codes set at the same time it seems to go into "limp mode" and the transmission will shift really hard until I manually clear the codes.
I have a check engine light that comes and goes. My OBD I/II scanner indicates a misfire on cylinder #1 and sometimes on cylinder #2. This started about 2 years ago after I replaced the factory spark plugs at 70K w new Iridium plugs. I've swapped coil packs between Cyl's 1 & 2 with no change. I even swapped coil packs Cyl's #1 & #2 with Cyl's #3 & #4 trying to isolate the issue. But the cylinder # 1 misfire code resets.
I also get a traction control light that started coming on after replacing the front rotors and pads @ 70K w/ new Raybestos ones. That code said the front brakes were out of spec's? I can clear that code and within a couple weeks it will reappear.
When both codes set at the same time it seems to go into "limp mode" and the transmission will shift really hard until I manually clear the codes.
08-10-2018, 11:40 AM
#6
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Join Date: 10-04-2015
Location: Whitney Texas
Posts: 41
Donbrew asks if there were any CEL's on! I just tried to answer his question and explain what I had done to address the codes that were set as a result of the CEL's being on. I have no Idea what it has to do with the A/C issue, Donbrew ask the question and I did my best to answer it! Are the Check/Service Engine and Traction Control Service lights not CEL's ??
08-10-2018, 01:39 PM
#7
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The reason I asked is that some codes can inhibit the AC.
My reasoning is that an intermittent problem could cause the compressor to intermittently work causing an odd pressure reading, like a slipping AC clutch.
TC on after brake job sounds like the wheel speed wire got disturbed. Or the hub is bad.
For the misfire a compression/leakdown would narrow thing down.
Of course maybe you got the wrong iridium plugs (ACDelco 41-103 ONLY!). And maybe there is a different code that comes when the trans shifts hard and causes the TC light. Like P0010-P0014.
My reasoning is that an intermittent problem could cause the compressor to intermittently work causing an odd pressure reading, like a slipping AC clutch.
TC on after brake job sounds like the wheel speed wire got disturbed. Or the hub is bad.
For the misfire a compression/leakdown would narrow thing down.
Of course maybe you got the wrong iridium plugs (ACDelco 41-103 ONLY!). And maybe there is a different code that comes when the trans shifts hard and causes the TC light. Like P0010-P0014.
08-10-2018, 06:24 PM
#9
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Join Date: 10-04-2015
Location: Whitney Texas
Posts: 41
I decided to do a little more investigating this morning to try and find my freon leak. I started by using an electronic freon detector. The only area I got any responses was toward the front of the compressor. I have an auto lift in my shop so up the HHR went and I removed the compressor splash shield. It seemed to be running and cycling normally but what I discovered when I broke out the blacklight & UV glasses was the entire front of the clutch and pully was covered with UV dye. So that explains the freon loss. After 8 years and 76K miles, it's probably not worth just replacing the front seal so I figure its time for a new compressor & condenser.
With regards to the codes, the only one currently set is a P0301 $0738 Cylinder 1 Misfire Detected. The Traction Control CEL is lit on the dash but not code at the moment. I'm sure the ECM will bring that code back up after a few miles and I will post it.
I don't recall what brand or number the new iridium plugs I installed were, its been about 2 years. I pull one out and put that info on here. Thanks for the help guys!
Edit: I just pulled a spark plug and can verify I did replace the plugs with ACDelco 41-103 plugs. I actually found the OEM plugs a drawer in my tool box and they still have the plastic covers on them. The originals had 67K miles, there a pretty black but no real carbon deposits them to speak of. Would it be worthwhile to swap one out into the cylinder that's triggering the misfires? Maybe I just got a bad plug when I replaced the OEM's 2 years ago?
With regards to the codes, the only one currently set is a P0301 $0738 Cylinder 1 Misfire Detected. The Traction Control CEL is lit on the dash but not code at the moment. I'm sure the ECM will bring that code back up after a few miles and I will post it.
I don't recall what brand or number the new iridium plugs I installed were, its been about 2 years. I pull one out and put that info on here. Thanks for the help guys!
Edit: I just pulled a spark plug and can verify I did replace the plugs with ACDelco 41-103 plugs. I actually found the OEM plugs a drawer in my tool box and they still have the plastic covers on them. The originals had 67K miles, there a pretty black but no real carbon deposits them to speak of. Would it be worthwhile to swap one out into the cylinder that's triggering the misfires? Maybe I just got a bad plug when I replaced the OEM's 2 years ago?
Last edited by HeavyHook; 08-10-2018 at 07:37 PM. Reason: add more info
08-10-2018, 11:07 PM
#10
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Join Date: 04-03-2018
Location: Florida
Posts: 234
You didn't mention how quickly you loose the refrigerant.
Your pressures point to some wear in your compressor but with 37°, I wouldn't rush to replace it, unless you loose it fairly quickly.
As far as your plugs go, they shouldn't be black at all.
The originals I pulled out of the 2011 looked like brand new, just not as shiney, that's with 100k on it. Could have regapped them and reused.
My p/u has 200k on 7 of the original 8 plugs and not black.
Iridium plugs are a lot different than plugs of yesteryear.
Try swapping an old plug first , if still black, you'll have to look further.
Your pressures point to some wear in your compressor but with 37°, I wouldn't rush to replace it, unless you loose it fairly quickly.
As far as your plugs go, they shouldn't be black at all.
The originals I pulled out of the 2011 looked like brand new, just not as shiney, that's with 100k on it. Could have regapped them and reused.
My p/u has 200k on 7 of the original 8 plugs and not black.
Iridium plugs are a lot different than plugs of yesteryear.
Try swapping an old plug first , if still black, you'll have to look further.