OK no problem, it's all good.

 

As someone employed as an engineer by GM in the US, I can tell you that my job is supported by vehicles like the HHR that were built elsewhere, but engineered here. My group was actively involved in designing assembly and paint systems for it. The same thing applies for Canadian-built Camaros and Impalas, just as it would for a Lansing-built CTS.

The people doing my job for Toyota do not reside here. Their value-adding jobs remain in Japan. I think this is easier for me to see because I'm "in it", but there is a world of difference in the economic impact by each. And, the Koreans have even less design and engineering here. People are entitled to their opinions, and I'm fine with discussions, too. But to me, you need to look at where the most economic value is contributed, as well as where the profits go. The world IS global, but those high-value jobs are not. I think that applies to both Ford and GM at the moment.

As for Chrysler, what I hear is that it is mixed more than it was under Daimler, meaning it's more Fiat than it used to be, but there is still a lot of work being done at the US headquarters. They lost so many people that this doesn't surprise me. I think they lost some critical mass, and have to rely on Italian design and engineering to move forward.

 

Never owned anything other then GM, FORD, or Dodge. So, I don't know or care to know how a Toyota or Honda runs.

 

This is a point lost on many.

GM like most companies is now global but the main base is here. In fac much of what all the engineers do today goes to build cars world wide now and not just for those built in Lansing.

Same applies to the imports too as they are doing a lot of work here too but the main base is still in Asia etc.

As for Chrysler they are now more a design and American arm of Fiat. Nearly all their FWD cars will be based on Fiats and some of the furure RWD will go to other divisions of Fiat. Daimler screwed up and pretty much left the small car market with Chrysler and they are now in great need of a small car as the Caliber just was not enough.

In fact Daimler realy only cared much for Trucks, Jeep and the LX RWD cars.

While GM still does a lot globally most of what they do still comes back to Detroit before, during and in the end.

I worry more about the gobal market in China as in China it is the fastest growing maket. It is a market they all need to be in to make it into the future. THe only issue is that to sell and build cars there you need a Chinese partner. These partners are basically stealing the Intellectual property from those soing business there. This puts most MFG over a barrel.

GM right now would love to sell the Volt there but they do not want to share the info required with the Chinese to sell it there. If they do the Chinese will start building their own electrics with the Volt technology. But that does not mean they won't buy one and steal it anyways.

Anyways to buy American still has some added benefit to this country that will never be felt if you buy from a MFG based overseas. On the converse to buy a overseas brand built here is not as bad as in the past since some of the money is left here. That is as long as the dollars value keeps it cheaper to keep building them here.

Either way I try to stay loyal as I can to the brands here. To this point I have never owned a car not based in Michigan. It is just my small part for buying things a Walmart. LOL!

 

That brings to mind an article I saw this morning:
http://www.autoblog.com/2012/01/31/c...es-ford-f-150/

 

Oh my god, how can that even be legal. It sure looks like copyright infringement/something of that nature to me. The headlights are exactly the same, heck, it even has a blue oval. I sure hope I never see a Chinese "copy" of an HHR, that might put me over the edge.

 

Chery in China built a car that was so close to the Chevy version that the fenders were said to interchange. GM was none too happy about this.

China is well known for their automotive knock offs.

 

Out of the six cars I presently own 4 are chevrolet, 2 are Japanese.

My two Japanese cars ranging from low cost to high are the best cars I've ever owned, problem is they are not near my favorite cars and I must admit I feel a little guilt on buying them.

I very much love buying American (if there really is a such thing anymore), but I'm also a realist and know you can't compete domestically with cheap labor and material costs unless you build a high quality product (see bmw).

Given that, I have mixed feelings and would love the see the streets covered in the latest Ford, Chevy and Chryslers, designed and built in America. I also was far from favoring the auto bailout because it was so politically motivated towards the unions and the manufacturing swing states.

Few if any other industries got bailouts (except banks) and that saddens me knowing how hard hit most small business are.

Anyway, I do love and believe America will come back and come back strong, I just know we need a rethink on our priorities and buying at a company like Walmart is one of them, (or not buying at Wall-Mart).

I've never bought at Wall-Mart, never will and not because they buy stuff from China, but because they have stripped our country of small retail business, mostly through tax incentives, massive lobbying and municiple favors.

BTW: Early on Clint Eastwood ran for Mayor in Carmel as a republican and was against the auto bailouts, so Alexrod can tweet to his fingers wear off, but a compelling commercial won't change the facts and reading into the lines of a scriptwriter, doesn't mean this commercial was a toss to the Obama administration, it was a testimate to the citizens of Detroit trying to fight their way back.



IMO

 

I an tired of the political games on the bail outs. I am the last person to support Bama but he did what the republicans also would have done. To lose one automaker of this size would have been a great mess but to lose two would have been something that could have done damage that would have taken years to repair. I am not happy with pawning off Chrysler to Fiat but the fact is no one else wanted them.

I have worked on and with cars since I was 12 years old. I have seen the highs and the lows of things. Building and running a car company is not an easy task. They all make mistakes and they all anymore make some very good and som ehhh cars.

The folks who write off American cars are a little short sighted and ill informed. Also those who think the likes of Toyota, Honda and BMW can do no wrong has never seen how much money repair shops make off these cars. There were enough head gasket issues on the Civic alone that my one buddy help pay for his airplane with the repairs they took in on Hondas since many shops turned them away. Same for the others.

There was a time the American cars were at a great disadvatage but no longer. The fact is for the most when it comes to many things the public as a whole are mostly idiots because they are like sheep and believe all they are told. That is why people buy some of the things they do and they elect some of the many fools we have.

The bottom line is today that most companies make pretty good cars and they all have some older models that are not so good. But with that said even the bad models today are far better than most cars in the past. People tend to not know of understand how bad all cars in the past were. They see old resotred cars today and don't consider many of these cars were rusted out before 100,000 miles.

My GTP is has just turned over 100,000 miles and still looks like new even here in the heart of the rust belt. It has been a good car and other than a couple small issues it has been a very good car. Most of my GM cars have been trouble free for the most part. They could have used better materials and things like that on the interior etc but also have seen many a Honda and Toyota with holes in the faded seats.

The bottom line is the number of people and companies that would have lost their jobs would have made such an impact on this country that the bail outs had to be done. If not we not only would have lost Chrysle, China would have bought GM and most of the smaller companies in the supplier segment would have gone under. It was more than just about the two automakers it was about anyone connected to it. Here in the mid west we have seen enough plants close and when just a plant closes it takes a whole city or region with it. Imagine if Chrysler has closes all the plants? They also use the same suppliers and it would have effected Ford as they would have had to pay more for their parts since less were made. The price of a car would have climbed.

I just with the Dems and Repubs would knock off the BS as there is enough other things that need to be addressed here in this country. At least GM and Chrysler are making payments back but has anyone seen a bank that has returned to big profits make a payment? No one says a thing there.

It is time people take the time to read and learn about people and who are supporting them before they vote for them. I am not taking sides here as we have idiots on both sides. and even idiots in middle.

 

I agree politics should be taken out of this.

That's hard considering that 1 in 5 Americans receive some form of payment from the government, 47.5% of all citizens do not pay any taxes and 25% of the workforce (mostly small business owners) pay 75% of all the Federal budget.

People complain but they like sucking on the Government tit.

As far as banks, I have no love for them but all the large banks have repaid the TARP loans. The continue to borrow from the Treasury, but they always have for liquidity reasons.

AIG for instance, has repaid their loans with interest, and is one of the top 2012 stock earners. Compare that to GM's new IPO.

Now in regards to the Auto industry, Chrysler should have been let go. It was down to nothing and other than a few jobs, giving it to Fiat and the UAW doesn't really do anything for America.

GM could have done like Ford and leveraged their property and plants (borrowed) gone through proper bankruptcy and left the tax payer out of it.

Do the math and the Taxpayer will never receive their money back from the GM bailout. Even little Timmy Gettner admits that.

Now GM's problems were obvious. They have all their profit in trucks, overpaid bad management, had high labor and entitlement costs and gave 50% of their market to the Japanese. Bob Lutz can scream all he wants about Toyota, but they built a car people wanted and offered good service.

I'm not a fan, just stating the facts.

GM's 8 billion dollar profit is a farce. They actually owe the Government (The U.S. citizens) 30 billion in shares, plus they received a 45 billion dollar tax right off after bankruptcy. No other company in the universe gets to carry debt forward after bankruptcy because that is written off it's books.

To top it off GM still does not pay any corporate tax.

It's a paper only number to make GM and politicians look good.

As far as any taxpayer dollars rewarding bad business, I'm 100% against it. The Government doesn't bail out the music industry over bad management, they don't help the mom and pop stores that Wal-Mart has erased from the landscape, but they do kiss the UAW's ass for votes.

If it wasn't for Government cronyism the UAW would be dead and rightfully so. It's an overwhelming mess that steals from their members and the public. No large union in America could survive an audit of their pension accounts. The future is in right to work states. Indiana became right to work last week and gained a new auto factory.

Yes, it is half time in America. Let's just hope the 2nd half rewards innovative and intelligent hard work rather than government hand outs protecting $58 an hour "screw the fender on the car" jobs with politicians pandering to the 4 dwindling swing states that determine an election.

IMO